spacemonkey
I see dead people.
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Cool, good to know! Any ideas on how much paint I will need?
1993 M900- It begins.....
- Thread starter spacemonkey
- Start date
One can is enough to do the outer covers.
That is alternator cover, sprocket cover, clutch side cover and belt covers. (yes okay on plastic)
Once you are ready to go you must apply all the coats within a certain time, basically this amounts to one single session for all the coats, if you don't get it coated within the timeframe then there is a long wait before you can start again...24 hours or more I think.
Don't bother counting the coats just keep blowing it on till it's covered nicely, but do start with very thin coats.
Normal running of the engine is enough to cure the paint, it's even gone very hard indeed on my belt covers which don't get anything like as hot as the metal bits.
I think the paint doesn't need the heat to cure hard so much as to impart chemical resistance, which I take to mean oil and petrol.
Possibly there are harder paint types which would be more suitable for footrest hangars?
That said I am finding the VHT to be quite robust.
I gave up using the same oven for food for anything other than that years ago....It will stink for months and gawd knows what chemical compounds it leaves behind..
That is alternator cover, sprocket cover, clutch side cover and belt covers. (yes okay on plastic)
Once you are ready to go you must apply all the coats within a certain time, basically this amounts to one single session for all the coats, if you don't get it coated within the timeframe then there is a long wait before you can start again...24 hours or more I think.
Don't bother counting the coats just keep blowing it on till it's covered nicely, but do start with very thin coats.
Normal running of the engine is enough to cure the paint, it's even gone very hard indeed on my belt covers which don't get anything like as hot as the metal bits.
I think the paint doesn't need the heat to cure hard so much as to impart chemical resistance, which I take to mean oil and petrol.
Possibly there are harder paint types which would be more suitable for footrest hangars?
That said I am finding the VHT to be quite robust.
I gave up using the same oven for food for anything other than that years ago....It will stink for months and gawd knows what chemical compounds it leaves behind..
spacemonkey
I see dead people.
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Cool! In that case I will get 2 cans of primer/colourcoat. Not really sure about the clearcoat. I guess that would need adding after the 24 hours of the colour coat anyway? But does it really need it?
The clear lacquer goes on wet on wet in the same session as the all the other coats.
That is to say, enough time for your arm to nearly fall off with shaking the can inbetween coats...Something like 10 minutes.
I used the clear over my Gold cases, and I feel that this is what gives it it's hard shell.
It certainly changes the colour a little bit...Probably tone would be a better word than colour.
I think you are going for silver?
I have had some interesting results spray varnishing over a "Silver Wheels" type Silver.
The silver on it's own is a sort of harsh BZP type finish, but if I go over it with clear Humbrol aerosol varnish it changes the effect to something closer to that found on say, original silver footrest hangars.
As I spray the clear on before the silver has fully dried, it has a melting effect (wet on wet).
I really like the effect, which I use on the odd bracket here and there...Looks just right on the old smiths speedo drive gearboxes.!
Clear over the fully cured paint has a different effect. I can't really describe it, but not so nice an effect in my opinion.
If I were you I would buy the clear VHT and try wet on wet and clear over cured, on a test piece....I suspect clear wet on wet is going to look very close to original and be harder..
That is to say, enough time for your arm to nearly fall off with shaking the can inbetween coats...Something like 10 minutes.
I used the clear over my Gold cases, and I feel that this is what gives it it's hard shell.
It certainly changes the colour a little bit...Probably tone would be a better word than colour.
I think you are going for silver?
I have had some interesting results spray varnishing over a "Silver Wheels" type Silver.
The silver on it's own is a sort of harsh BZP type finish, but if I go over it with clear Humbrol aerosol varnish it changes the effect to something closer to that found on say, original silver footrest hangars.
As I spray the clear on before the silver has fully dried, it has a melting effect (wet on wet).
I really like the effect, which I use on the odd bracket here and there...Looks just right on the old smiths speedo drive gearboxes.!
Clear over the fully cured paint has a different effect. I can't really describe it, but not so nice an effect in my opinion.
If I were you I would buy the clear VHT and try wet on wet and clear over cured, on a test piece....I suspect clear wet on wet is going to look very close to original and be harder..
spacemonkey
I see dead people.
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Thanks for that!
spacemonkey
I see dead people.
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OK, finally got back on track with this. Last year by the time I had got the paint together the weather had turned and the temps dropped and humidity raised, so covered it up for the winter.
As a temporary fix, I bought a 25k mile mk1 1200 Bandit with full Akro system, rearsets, hi lift cams, dynojet/k&ns, GSXR shock and stuff I don;t know about for £1k as well as all the bits people add to these including new Bridgestone 023 tyres. And it's black and gold.. Changed fork seals and uprated the oil to 15w and fitted new chain, sprockets and Renthal gold Streetfighter bars. All good and got me back in the big bike groove. More or less same riding position and suspension feel as the Monster, but weaker brakes and no engine braking in comparison. Much faster once wound up though- hit 90 in top and twat the throttle and it goes all Millenium Falcon on me. Quite addictive but reminded me how much I miss my Monster. I'm also planning on buying a new bike later in the year to join the Monster for eternity and number one choice by a zillion miles is the Indian Scout. Absolutely love it....
So today I got the heads and barrels off. IN the end I opted to keep the pistons in the barrels after reading so many reports of ring damage trying to reassemble. I reckon I can just tape up the bores to mask and the pistons will stay in place nicely. Gonna be fun re attaching to the con rods but I'll sort that when the time comes. Thanks to my cousin holding heavy things while I unclip etc.
Now the slight worry- as soon as I could, I put paper towel in the crankcases to stop dirt and clips falling down there but I'm worried that inevitable some crud from around the barrel/crankcase openings must have gone in the vertical. Any advice on what I can do to try to flush anything out? The oil was drained last year but I wondered if it was a good idea to flush through with some very thin oil to try and flush any crud out?? Or shouldn't I worry?
The plan is to mask off the openings and then start removing paint. I have lots of small brass brushes on a dremel thing and that works quite well. Then mask up and spray. The heads need the oil seals doing and to get them generally checked over. Desmo is fine as only recently done before lay up. More worried about valve seats or stems. Probabyl; fine though as I always had it fully serviced bang on time and up to now has FSH by various Ducati specialist. It ran fine only a little smoke from the oil seals IMO. I'm going to use brass brushes on them then to get the paint and oxide off and paint them seperately before refitting.
So to recap, any advice on cleanign potential crud from insde the crankcase or not to worry? It's dirt from around the barrel bottoms.
As a temporary fix, I bought a 25k mile mk1 1200 Bandit with full Akro system, rearsets, hi lift cams, dynojet/k&ns, GSXR shock and stuff I don;t know about for £1k as well as all the bits people add to these including new Bridgestone 023 tyres. And it's black and gold.. Changed fork seals and uprated the oil to 15w and fitted new chain, sprockets and Renthal gold Streetfighter bars. All good and got me back in the big bike groove. More or less same riding position and suspension feel as the Monster, but weaker brakes and no engine braking in comparison. Much faster once wound up though- hit 90 in top and twat the throttle and it goes all Millenium Falcon on me. Quite addictive but reminded me how much I miss my Monster. I'm also planning on buying a new bike later in the year to join the Monster for eternity and number one choice by a zillion miles is the Indian Scout. Absolutely love it....
So today I got the heads and barrels off. IN the end I opted to keep the pistons in the barrels after reading so many reports of ring damage trying to reassemble. I reckon I can just tape up the bores to mask and the pistons will stay in place nicely. Gonna be fun re attaching to the con rods but I'll sort that when the time comes. Thanks to my cousin holding heavy things while I unclip etc.
Now the slight worry- as soon as I could, I put paper towel in the crankcases to stop dirt and clips falling down there but I'm worried that inevitable some crud from around the barrel/crankcase openings must have gone in the vertical. Any advice on what I can do to try to flush anything out? The oil was drained last year but I wondered if it was a good idea to flush through with some very thin oil to try and flush any crud out?? Or shouldn't I worry?
The plan is to mask off the openings and then start removing paint. I have lots of small brass brushes on a dremel thing and that works quite well. Then mask up and spray. The heads need the oil seals doing and to get them generally checked over. Desmo is fine as only recently done before lay up. More worried about valve seats or stems. Probabyl; fine though as I always had it fully serviced bang on time and up to now has FSH by various Ducati specialist. It ran fine only a little smoke from the oil seals IMO. I'm going to use brass brushes on them then to get the paint and oxide off and paint them seperately before refitting.
So to recap, any advice on cleanign potential crud from insde the crankcase or not to worry? It's dirt from around the barrel bottoms.
spacemonkey
I see dead people.
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So in the end I stuffed the hoover in there. Most of the bits that fell in are from the sealant around the base. I can see one white bit which shows up in the pics between the crank weight at the bottom of the pic and the crankcase. Probably not serious and could flush through. There's a couple of small bits on the bottom of the crankcases below the cranks but again, should flush into the filter or flush through?
The heads look like they need a little decoking but initially they look fine.
The gudgeon pins look like they are wearing. What d'you all reckon? Looks lkke new ones needed if they are available. Might as well do the bearings too.
Used brake cleaner and then xylene to degrease the engine block and remove the bigger flakes. Took ages and lots of cotton buds but now it's ready to rub down to remove the paint. Hopefully there will be no grease in the nooks and crannies. The studs have got a bit of corrosion. The vertical ones only at the base, but the horizontal ones have about 3 inches from the base as well. I guess the black coating has now gone on it. I'll rub them down before refitting the barrels and give them a lick of smoothrite. Any advice on whether to grease them before assembly and if so which grease?
The heads look like they need a little decoking but initially they look fine.
The gudgeon pins look like they are wearing. What d'you all reckon? Looks lkke new ones needed if they are available. Might as well do the bearings too.
Used brake cleaner and then xylene to degrease the engine block and remove the bigger flakes. Took ages and lots of cotton buds but now it's ready to rub down to remove the paint. Hopefully there will be no grease in the nooks and crannies. The studs have got a bit of corrosion. The vertical ones only at the base, but the horizontal ones have about 3 inches from the base as well. I guess the black coating has now gone on it. I'll rub them down before refitting the barrels and give them a lick of smoothrite. Any advice on whether to grease them before assembly and if so which grease?
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I'm with you on the Indian Scout, never felt remotely inclined towards Harley's, this somehow is very appealing.
Also looks like remarkable value at just over £10k.
2 bikes in the garage already, with a bit of man maths the numbers would work out........divorce is almost a certainty however.
Also looks like remarkable value at just over £10k.
2 bikes in the garage already, with a bit of man maths the numbers would work out........divorce is almost a certainty however.
spacemonkey
I see dead people.
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Well I want another bike and it has to be something totally different to the Monster, which will never go, and the Monkey which likewise is a keeper. I've tried the faired sporty thing and I just don't like it. 916/900ss excepted.
Never really been in to Harleys, but the 48 is lovely especially in this retro scheme:
But the Indian....
So it's a big toss up between the Scout or something like a Tiger 800 XCx or 800GS. I think the Scout would win then get a cheapy F800 GS for commuting.
So, just been to Moto Rapido and th spanner guy reckons the gudgeons are fine and that it's only oil staining so happy with that. Bought some new clips though just in case.
Now one of the reasons to take the barrels off is to stop the oil leak at the back of the vertical cylinder. Suprisingly, the Orings seemed ok and there was no evidence of oil leaks from the head/barrel. The only other possibilities are a leak in the RTV at the base of the barrel or the breather. I've tightened the breather in the past but it never cured it. I was reading last night that the old style breather has been superceded as they used to leak slightly between the ally bit and the plastic. So maybe that's it? The new ones are £57 but I shall try first with the newly assembled cylinders with their new rings and see what happens then. I might take the breather off and give it a light coating of sealant where it screws in to rule that one out while it's easy to get to.
Never really been in to Harleys, but the 48 is lovely especially in this retro scheme:
But the Indian....
So it's a big toss up between the Scout or something like a Tiger 800 XCx or 800GS. I think the Scout would win then get a cheapy F800 GS for commuting.
So, just been to Moto Rapido and th spanner guy reckons the gudgeons are fine and that it's only oil staining so happy with that. Bought some new clips though just in case.
Now one of the reasons to take the barrels off is to stop the oil leak at the back of the vertical cylinder. Suprisingly, the Orings seemed ok and there was no evidence of oil leaks from the head/barrel. The only other possibilities are a leak in the RTV at the base of the barrel or the breather. I've tightened the breather in the past but it never cured it. I was reading last night that the old style breather has been superceded as they used to leak slightly between the ally bit and the plastic. So maybe that's it? The new ones are £57 but I shall try first with the newly assembled cylinders with their new rings and see what happens then. I might take the breather off and give it a light coating of sealant where it screws in to rule that one out while it's easy to get to.
re. the bits of crud in the cases....
Whether or not the system can deal with a few bits and pieces in the sump, if you know there were any left in there it will dig at your nerves for a while.
Maybe its best to make every possible effort to extract as much as you possibly can while you have the chance.
To which end I was thinking that if you taped a longish piece of thin, flexible tubing into the hoover nozzle you might be able to use that to get at the more inaccessible areas.
Whether or not the system can deal with a few bits and pieces in the sump, if you know there were any left in there it will dig at your nerves for a while.
Maybe its best to make every possible effort to extract as much as you possibly can while you have the chance.
To which end I was thinking that if you taped a longish piece of thin, flexible tubing into the hoover nozzle you might be able to use that to get at the more inaccessible areas.
Well I want another bike and it has to be something totally different to the Monster, which will never go, and the Monkey which likewise is a keeper. I've tried the faired sporty thing and I just don't like it. 916/900ss excepted.
Never really been in to Harleys, but the 48 is lovely especially in this retro scheme:
But the Indian....
So it's a big toss up between the Scout or something like a Tiger 800 XCx or 800GS. I think the Scout would win then get a cheapy F800 GS for commuting.
Well the outfit does rather suit a tractor..... :chuckle:
spacemonkey
I see dead people.
- Joined
- May 11, 2003
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- 1,469
- Bike
- M900
Oi can't read and Oi can't write, but it don't really matter,
'Cos I was born down in Darzet, and Oi can drive a trattor....
Darzet born and Darzet bread- strong in the arm and fick in the 'ead...
'Cos I was born down in Darzet, and Oi can drive a trattor....
Darzet born and Darzet bread- strong in the arm and fick in the 'ead...
spacemonkey
I see dead people.
- Joined
- May 11, 2003
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- 1,469
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- M900
Good idea. Apart from thin oil, does anyone know of anything that is safe to flush through as well just in case?
Is the oil filter pickup right at the bottom? Does the oil and debris go through a pump before the filter or after? Last time the engine was apart, the so called Ducati expert managed to drop a long piece of support bracket wire that holds th efuel or breather pipes to the carbs. And the engine was fine for 1000 miles until I found it dropping out of the sump when I changed the oil..... :banghead:
Can I get the heads/barrels blasted on the outside only? I'm intent on leaving the piston in the barrels, but am very tempted with soda blasting but admit I know nothing about it. I assume I can mask off the innner parts, but if so, how? Tape??
Make that four!
Make that 5 now.
Just wondering whether you got that bolt out. I was lucky on mine and was surprised that both engine bolts were allen key headed and were very well greased so easily removed.
I take it your not going down that route of drilling the end out of the threaded end and then technically the allen key end would/should freely rotate and if so be easily punched out through. Look forward to see any progress soon.
spacemonkey
I see dead people.
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Hi mate, no, leaving the bolts in for now.
Heads away having the valve stem oil seals done and a general checkover. Not much else happened to it as I bought yet another bike- this time a 95 VFR750FS. Always wanted one and it's ideal for my 200 mile commute. Looks damned fine too! Just gave it the 4 step Meguirs treatment and it positively glows! Ok, so the forks are soggy as standard and dive like a mafia backed boxer, and the brakes are sliding twin pots and have as much bite as my dead granny despite a full refurb, but it's great to ride and that 4 four is lovely... Just needs Firestorm forks with revalve and upgraded springs and Firestorm calipers and the standard shock rebuilt and that cures that. A dynojet kit, filter and hi level can relases a nice fat chunk of midrange and a sound like a Yankee V8. Oooh yeah.. and 53mpg even when thrashed over my run giving a nice 250 mile range easily. Came with a nasty fliop screen which I have changed for a standard one as it gives me a nice support at speed to stop my wrists aching and lets me feel a bit of the wind. Also got rid of some noisy turbulance on my lid.
Pics before polishing...
Heads away having the valve stem oil seals done and a general checkover. Not much else happened to it as I bought yet another bike- this time a 95 VFR750FS. Always wanted one and it's ideal for my 200 mile commute. Looks damned fine too! Just gave it the 4 step Meguirs treatment and it positively glows! Ok, so the forks are soggy as standard and dive like a mafia backed boxer, and the brakes are sliding twin pots and have as much bite as my dead granny despite a full refurb, but it's great to ride and that 4 four is lovely... Just needs Firestorm forks with revalve and upgraded springs and Firestorm calipers and the standard shock rebuilt and that cures that. A dynojet kit, filter and hi level can relases a nice fat chunk of midrange and a sound like a Yankee V8. Oooh yeah.. and 53mpg even when thrashed over my run giving a nice 250 mile range easily. Came with a nasty fliop screen which I have changed for a standard one as it gives me a nice support at speed to stop my wrists aching and lets me feel a bit of the wind. Also got rid of some noisy turbulance on my lid.
Pics before polishing...
Hi mate, no, leaving the bolts in for now.
Heads away having the valve stem oil seals done and a general checkover. Not much else happened to it as I bought yet another bike- this time a 95 VFR750FS. Always wanted one and it's ideal for my 200 mile commute. Looks damned fine too! Just gave it the 4 step Meguirs treatment and it positively glows! Ok, so the forks are soggy as standard and dive like a mafia backed boxer, and the brakes are sliding twin pots and have as much bite as my dead granny despite a full refurb, but it's great to ride and that 4 four is lovely... Just needs Firestorm forks with revalve and upgraded springs and Firestorm calipers and the standard shock rebuilt and that cures that. A dynojet kit, filter and hi level can relases a nice fat chunk of midrange and a sound like a Yankee V8. Oooh yeah.. and 53mpg even when thrashed over my run giving a nice 250 mile range easily. Came with a nasty fliop screen which I have changed for a standard one as it gives me a nice support at speed to stop my wrists aching and lets me feel a bit of the wind. Also got rid of some noisy turbulance on my lid.
Pics before polishing...
Looks very smart and good for comfort and distance. Keep us updated soon.
spacemonkey
I see dead people.
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Has a nice white tacho but borning black everything else, with nasty 80's Ford style green backlighting. Uurgh... just got some red LEDs to convert that and make me feel more at home.
That's right- Alton it was!
I have a build/inspection ticket that I found in the bike somewhere years back and it is dated 10-03-93 at 14:38 hrs. I'll keep an eye out on bike parts as I strip them. Still suffering 'down below' so nothing happening to the bike yet....
Hi spacemonkey. Can you give us an idea of where this ticket might be stashed
I would love to have look to see if I can find It on mine.
spacemonkey
I see dead people.
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IIRC it was one of the breather pods under the airbox. It was definitely somewhere enclosed and quite a suprise when I found it.
In other news, I got the heads back yesterday. I asked for the oil seals to be done but he rebuilt the whole heads and lapped valves etc so quite pleased really. Also got my Indian racing jumper in the post! Just gotta get my Indian now...
In other news, I got the heads back yesterday. I asked for the oil seals to be done but he rebuilt the whole heads and lapped valves etc so quite pleased really. Also got my Indian racing jumper in the post! Just gotta get my Indian now...