M800ie Regulator/Rectifier replacment advice

Anyone know or recommend a better replacement reg for a M800ie..ive desktop searched and found the Shindengan FH020AA and the Compufire 55402 seem to be helpful in running cooler and removing some of the load off the stator. Any good, bad, ugly experiences ..the Compufire units a pretty exp cf standard Duc stuff...I'm after reliability, load, heat reduction..cheers..

[Flip]

These always seem to get good reviews and probably what I am going to go for on my '97 900 before too long to pre-empt the near twenty year old original giving out when I least need it to.

http://www.electrexworld.co.uk/acata...ifier_206.html

[slob]

http://www.ukmonster.co.uk/monster/s...ad.php?t=46708

[spuggy]

Originally Posted by GeoffM800

Anyone know or recommend a better replacement reg for a M800ie..ive desktop searched and found the Shindengan FH020AA and the Compufire 55402 seem to be helpful in running cooler and removing some of the load off the stator. Any good, bad, ugly experiences ..the Compufire units a pretty exp cf standard Duc stuff...I'm after reliability, load, heat reduction..cheers..

I've been noodling about this idea too. Be sure to read the excellent article that Kato posted and slob linked to.

Also lots of good info in this thread http://www.thegsresources.com/_forum...ES-R-R-Install

I'll try to summarize:

The Shindengan FH020 (like the earlier FH012 it replaces) is a FET SCR shunt.

So it will run cooler than an early non-MOSFET shunt. But it's still a shunt. These work by diverting the unused portion of the charging circuit to ground. That's what shunts do - and this does not reduce the load on the stator at all, as this runs 100% output, 100% duty cycle.

Series R/Rs switch off the charging circuit when they have enough power. Which lessens the load on the alternator/charging circuit and (perhaps) allows the engine to make marginally more power due to less drag. Some of the GS guys have even reported lower oil temps after switching to a series R/R...

I've not seen anyone complain of Monsters eating stators. However the Suzuki GS guys and some Triumph owners observe heat issues/browning and have to replace failed stators about every few (2) years or so, and many take to rewinding their own...

It seems that ducati weren't immune from R/R issues however http://www.ducati-upnorth.com/tech/chargingfailure.php

It seems later Ducati designs used the SH579 part (which would seem to be most probably a shunt. The SH572 according to https://www.shindengen.co.jp/product...catalog.html#1 is an SCR shunt rated at 25A and probably the SH579 is simply a higher-rated variant of that, perhaps OEM for Ducati).

What does your 800ie have fitted currently? What connectors does it have?


The Compufire 55402 is a Series SCR (as are the Shindengan SH775 and SH879). So is the CE 605 SB, a 50A rated unit available from Cycle Electric in the US (but this sucker weighs in at 3 pounds! http://www.stromtrooper.com/dl1000-2...er-photos.html).

Note that not all Compufires are series design R/R, apparently - but I don't know any more than I gleaned incidentally from web browsing, which seems to be that they they're large, often fitted to Hardly Davidson's, the company may not ship outside the US and may also not honour warranty claims if not fitted to the motorcycles they intended their kit for (ironically, it was Buell owners complaining about this).

[spuggy]

(and more info on the Shindengen series R/R's that wouldn't fit in the earlier post)


The SH775 and SH879 take the same connectors/loom as the FH012 or FH020 units, so if you have one of those already - or the Triumph "link lead" Kato refers to - they're a direct swap.

There's a known issue with the SH775 where it doesn't regulate voltage over 10,000 or 11,000 RPM (which i wouldn't have thought would be an issue for Monsters). You also won't get a charging light (apparently wouldn't with the FH020 either).

This guy (who's generally very well thought of) http://www.roadstercycle.com/ recommends the SH879 for Ducati 600 and says the SH775 doesn't work. But he's not very specific as to why.

The SH879 is a stock Suzuki part apparently used on a V4 revving to 12,000 RPM stock. It doesn't suffer from this problem. But it is $$$pendy, even on Fleabay - if you can find it (I found one)... It doesn't appear on Shindengen's product matrix - so probably OEM'd for Suzuki and only available through them...


Shindengen warn against counterfeited parts. They're a Japanese company. So very cheap units out of China could be a red flag. Although if they're actually made there (do Japanese companies still manufacture electronics in-country?), these could also just be "out the back door" units from the same place that makes the "official" units....


Personally, I concluded that I'd prefer a series-type SH879, but simply wasn't prepared to hand over the wonga for it - especially as I don't have any issues.

If I have issues with the stock unit, I'll go for the FH020 as a replacement, as this can be done very cheaply. Might even fit one preemptively, if i run out of other things to do (ha!). And then I might try an SH775 (as it's a 30 second swap if it doesn't work out).

And if I burn out a stator, I'll curse and go the whole hog...

[jerry]

I have changed a few over the years ,, I also fit a 6-8mm thick aluminium plate under new ones to act as a heat sink ,, especially on models where the RR is under the seat like on S4

[Nasher]

Originally Posted by Flip

These always seem to get good reviews and probably what I am going to go for on my '97 900 before too long to pre-empt the near twenty year old original giving out when I least need it to.

http://www.electrexworld.co.uk/acata...ifier_206.html

I have the RR51 on my 97 M900, fitted by a previous owner at some point in the bikes life.

The separate wires back to the +ve and -ve battery terminals are robust but untidy.
Plus my bike nearly caught fire when the bodged two main connectors from the alternator melted.

http://www.ukmonster.co.uk/monster/s...ad.php?t=52734

I've re-installed it with good connections and it's been fine ever since.

Nasher

[Mr Gazza]

Whatever kind of reg/rec you are using (Providing that it is not already shot), the Holy Grail of reliability is low resistance connections.
That is to say a connection which conducts electricity at least as well as the cables.

A high resistance connection is usually what kills the reg/rec and/or burns the cables out.
That would be a dirty, broken, loose or corroded connector.

I learnt from building and flying electric model planes, that bad connections produce radio noise which can and does interfere with the radio control...You may have heard it on your (pre DAB) radio? When a light switch is flicked, or an appliance is on the way out....Lightning gives off massive bursts of radio noise....Anyway..

The cure on model planes is to use Gold connectors, Gold is a very good conductor and does not corrode. Also, types used by aeromodellers are sprung in some way to ensure the connection is always tight.
I recommend Gold connectors, or simply eliminate the connectors and solder the joints.

Yes had the same problem on both of my Tuono's.

Loose connectors caused the rr plug to overheat and melt. Fixed by replacing stock connector with a higher rated one and soldering the cables into their individual connectors rather than crimped like Aprilia did at the factory.

[Flip]

Originally Posted by Nasher

I have the RR51 on my 97 M900, fitted by a previous owner at some point in the bikes life.

The separate wires back to the +ve and -ve battery terminals are robust but untidy.
Plus my bike nearly caught fire when the bodged two main connectors from the alternator melted.

http://www.ukmonster.co.uk/monster/s...ad.php?t=52734

I've re-installed it with good connections and it's been fine ever since.

Nasher

Yeah,I'm not keen on running the wires directly to the battery to be honest and I don't see why they need to be- assuming the rest of the wiring is ok.

Although I do think I am going to look at the wires from the Alternator and see about beefing them up with some thicker gauge stuff.

As my bike gets older I get a little more paranoid about it letting me down so a bit of preventative work should help keep me from worrying.

Which is why I was thinking about changing my RR in the first place as it's still the original.

The earlier bikes are a bit different of course as they have the single phase 350w alternator as opposed to the later bike's 3~ jobbies so they're up against it from the start really.

Out of interest has anyone pulled a knackered one apart? I presume it is only potted in some kind of epoxy?

Almost tempted to get hold of a pooped one and redo the innards myself.

Thanks for that SPUGGY... very well researched!
I got the original R/R still on the bike (stamped w RS 41 above 50 and 3E 14- whatever that means!) the connectors are standard ie white box-like 3pin for the three wires from the stator and black box-like4pin for the four wires heading back toward the battery.
I've also read of the issues w these connectors and their failure - I've also noticed the three yellow wires from the stator are beginning to become hard/brittle..but could be because they're 13 yrs old? Like FLIP I'm getting concerned about component failure (see my previous two threads!).
I'm leaning toward the Compufire system w upgraded connectors (considering the 'hardening of the arteries' from the stator I've noticed) the Compufire system is available via Amazon - not cheap - but a R/R failure far from home isn't something I'd like to entertain..esp here in Japan...where it'd easily cost an arm AND a leg to fix... Still curious if anyone has any Compufire system experience..

Well, finally got all the bits to replace the reg/rectifier.. Went with a shindengen mosfet unit kit, a bunch of ec3 connectors and some upgraded wiring. Happy to report the new unit pumps out a constant 14.2volts across the rev range - rock steady! Feeling much more confident about not getting stuck hundreds of Kim's from home - an upgrade i would recommend albeit a bit pricey (much cheaper than a carrier home!)... Cheers, back on the road again! G.

[alan s4]

Recently fitted an Electrex RR - no faffing about with cables, its a plug and play replacement. What a difference, no more "will she/won't she" when it comes to starting and the rev counter is now steady instead of bouncing around all over the place.