Tdc? - Page 2

Luddite · 29-04-2020, 06:49 PM

You're right about the closing clearances being out of spec. The manual does indeed specify a max of 0.05.

For what it's worth, these are my clearances at their last adjustment:

Joshua Brew · 29-04-2020, 08:57 PM

Yes my bill states 4 openers and 1 closer. The chap who looked at it was a reputable guy with mountains of Ducati experience recommended by a few people on here. I remember him saying they all needed adjusting. Potentially he could of swapped some shims for ones he had lying around. I must of checked them ten times in all using both methods. Each time getting the same results.
As I understand the spring takes up any slack but I may just adjust them as I won’t be riding it any time soon.

Joshua Brew · 29-04-2020, 09:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Luddite

You're right about the closing clearances being out of spec. The manual does indeed specify a max of 0.05.

For what it's worth, these are my clearances at their last adjustment:

That’s interesting to see that your closers were out a good amount too. I shall see if I can get shims as all the dealers are closed. Does anyone know an online store I can get them?

slob · 29-04-2020, 09:07 PM

I believe MotoRapido are taking parts orders

Joshua Brew · 30-04-2020, 01:38 PM

should i replace the collets as well or just stick to the closing shims? i hear it can upset your measurements! as the shims are £12 each i dont really wanting to be wasting any due to the clearances being different with new collets

slob · 30-04-2020, 01:45 PM

reuse the collets (unless you find broken ones, which you’ll want to replace)
you want to refit them the same way up as before. You’ll be able to see they’re polished/worn on the inner edge/up from contact with the valve stem and outer edge/down from contact with the shim.
I’d advise using a bit of workshop towel or similar to cover the oil galleries, to prevent any collets disappearing downwards as you’re taking them out. I use a telescopic magnet tool to pick them out, to avoid this happening.
I also use a very small hammer and an aluminium (soft enough not to risk mushrooming the valve tops) drift, to tap the top of the valves once they’re back in to make sure they’re properly seated.

Joshua Brew · 30-04-2020, 03:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by slob

reuse the collets (unless you find broken ones, which you’ll want to replace)
you want to refit them the same way up as before. You’ll be able to see they’re polished/worn on the inner edge/up from contact with the valve stem and outer edge/down from contact with the shim.
I’d advise using a bit of workshop towel or similar to cover the oil galleries, to prevent any collets disappearing downwards as you’re taking them out. I use a telescopic magnet tool to pick them out, to avoid this happening.
I also use a very small hammer and an aluminium (soft enough not to risk mushrooming the valve tops) drift, to tap the top of the valves once they’re back in to make sure they’re properly seated.

thanks thats great advice!
also would you say its possible to do the job with the airbox and things still on the bike? i have the battery and oil cooler out of the way. and do you use forceps to hold the valve up? do you wedge something in the side of the aperture to keep the closing rocker down or just push it down with a screwdriver as and when you need to?
when i slide the opening rocker over the cam is free to spin, will the rocker only slide back on to the cam in the correct position?

slob · 30-04-2020, 03:54 PM

I have some plastic forceps, I wouldn’t want to grip the valve with stainless ones without heat-shrink or something on the tips to protect the valve stems. That said, I’ve used tiny cable-ties to do the job. You may find you have to rock the emgine back or forwards a little to slide the rockers across, as they can catch on the next cam lobe. Careful removing the spring clips, they’re a classic ‘pingphuckit’, which is the sound heard if they disappear across the workshop.
Make sure the clips go back in with one washer either side, the washers tend to stick together with oil after being pushed over by the rocker.
Check out ‘ducatitech’ on youtube, Chris from CA Cycleworks has done some excellent videos on shimming 2v motors.
https://youtu.be/dIj3nSJGPZw
https://youtu.be/3WQY1MRlmH4
You should be fine with the airbox in place.
Make sure you turn the engine slowly by hand twice by hand afterwards to make sure everything’s right.

Joshua Brew · 03-05-2020, 08:38 AM

Hello! I’ve taken the belts off and re checked the clearances and they are ever so slightly different to what I measured with them on? A couple of the opening clearances are just over around 0.16. My question is... do you adjust the adjust and check the clearances with the belts on or off? And why would they be different?

Joshua Brew · 10-05-2020, 12:53 PM

Just a quick update... I have now carried out the valve adjustment and belt change! And the bike even started afterwards! To say the least it was a good challenge. Those little pesky collets, but all in all i found it fairly straight forward. I have fitted the exact fit belts from CCW, they state the tension is to be around 90HZ, I’m struggling to get any sort of consultant threading from the Gates carbon drive app. Does anyone know if there are any better ones out there?

slob · 10-05-2020, 12:59 PM

consultant threading?! consistent reading?? Do I smell an auto spell checker at work?

I found the Gates app better than than various guitar tuner apps I'd used previously, which always pick up all kinds of odd harmonics. I always check with allen keys afterwards, although one you've done it a couple of times you know what feels right.

Luddite · 10-05-2020, 01:04 PM

I've not used this, (or any frequency app actually), but you could try the Continental app mentioned here:

http://www.ukmonster.co.uk/monster/s...ad.php?t=56189

Make sure you pluck at the right points, (see here http://www.ukmonster.co.uk/monster/s...t=58330&page=2). And most apps need a second or so to register the frequency so pluck once and let the frequency settle before trying again (rather than constantly strumming it).

Hope that helps.

350TSS · 10-05-2020, 01:05 PM

so Slob - if it was right on the app and wrong on the Allen key what would you do?

slob · 10-05-2020, 01:30 PM

with less experience, recheck both ways but ultimately trust the allen keys, the problem with the app is not the ultimate reading, it’s consistency

350TSS · 11-05-2020, 03:18 AM

So if you trust the allen keys you do not need the app?

30-04-2020, 01:45 PM	#21
slob . Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: East London Bike: Multiple Monsters Posts: 9,710	reuse the collets (unless you find broken ones, which you’ll want to replace) you want to refit them the same way up as before. You’ll be able to see they’re polished/worn on the inner edge/up from contact with the valve stem and outer edge/down from contact with the shim. I’d advise using a bit of workshop towel or similar to cover the oil galleries, to prevent any collets disappearing downwards as you’re taking them out. I use a telescopic magnet tool to pick them out, to avoid this happening. I also use a very small hammer and an aluminium (soft enough not to risk mushrooming the valve tops) drift, to tap the top of the valves once they’re back in to make sure they’re properly seated. Last edited by slob; 30-04-2020 at 01:48 PM..

30-04-2020, 03:54 PM	#23
slob . Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: East London Bike: Multiple Monsters Posts: 9,710	I have some plastic forceps, I wouldn’t want to grip the valve with stainless ones without heat-shrink or something on the tips to protect the valve stems. That said, I’ve used tiny cable-ties to do the job. You may find you have to rock the emgine back or forwards a little to slide the rockers across, as they can catch on the next cam lobe. Careful removing the spring clips, they’re a classic ‘pingphuckit’, which is the sound heard if they disappear across the workshop. Make sure the clips go back in with one washer either side, the washers tend to stick together with oil after being pushed over by the rocker. Check out ‘ducatitech’ on youtube, Chris from CA Cycleworks has done some excellent videos on shimming 2v motors. https://youtu.be/dIj3nSJGPZw https://youtu.be/3WQY1MRlmH4 You should be fine with the airbox in place. Make sure you turn the engine slowly by hand twice by hand afterwards to make sure everything’s right. Last edited by slob; 30-04-2020 at 04:02 PM..

03-05-2020, 08:38 AM	#24
Joshua Brew Registered User Join Date: Feb 2017 Location: Wrexham Bike: M1100evo Posts: 55	Hello! I’ve taken the belts off and re checked the clearances and they are ever so slightly different to what I measured with them on? A couple of the opening clearances are just over around 0.16. My question is... do you adjust the adjust and check the clearances with the belts on or off? And why would they be different? Last edited by Joshua Brew; 03-05-2020 at 10:05 AM.. Reason: Text

29-04-2020, 06:49 PM	#16
Luddite Registered User Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: Southampton Bike: M1100evo Posts: 2,465	You're right about the closing clearances being out of spec. The manual does indeed specify a max of 0.05. For what it's worth, these are my clearances at their last adjustment:

29-04-2020, 08:57 PM	#17
Joshua Brew Registered User Join Date: Feb 2017 Location: Wrexham Bike: M1100evo Posts: 55	Yes my bill states 4 openers and 1 closer. The chap who looked at it was a reputable guy with mountains of Ducati experience recommended by a few people on here. I remember him saying they all needed adjusting. Potentially he could of swapped some shims for ones he had lying around. I must of checked them ten times in all using both methods. Each time getting the same results. As I understand the spring takes up any slack but I may just adjust them as I won’t be riding it any time soon.

29-04-2020, 09:07 PM	#19
slob . Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: East London Bike: Multiple Monsters Posts: 9,710	I believe MotoRapido are taking parts orders

30-04-2020, 01:38 PM	#20
Joshua Brew Registered User Join Date: Feb 2017 Location: Wrexham Bike: M1100evo Posts: 55	should i replace the collets as well or just stick to the closing shims? i hear it can upset your measurements! as the shims are £12 each i dont really wanting to be wasting any due to the clearances being different with new collets

10-05-2020, 12:53 PM	#25
Joshua Brew Registered User Join Date: Feb 2017 Location: Wrexham Bike: M1100evo Posts: 55	Just a quick update... I have now carried out the valve adjustment and belt change! And the bike even started afterwards! To say the least it was a good challenge. Those little pesky collets, but all in all i found it fairly straight forward. I have fitted the exact fit belts from CCW, they state the tension is to be around 90HZ, I’m struggling to get any sort of consultant threading from the Gates carbon drive app. Does anyone know if there are any better ones out there?

10-05-2020, 12:59 PM	#26
slob . Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: East London Bike: Multiple Monsters Posts: 9,710	consultant threading?! consistent reading?? Do I smell an auto spell checker at work? I found the Gates app better than than various guitar tuner apps I'd used previously, which always pick up all kinds of odd harmonics. I always check with allen keys afterwards, although one you've done it a couple of times you know what feels right.

10-05-2020, 01:04 PM	#27
Luddite Registered User Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: Southampton Bike: M1100evo Posts: 2,465	I've not used this, (or any frequency app actually), but you could try the Continental app mentioned here: http://www.ukmonster.co.uk/monster/s...ad.php?t=56189 Make sure you pluck at the right points, (see here http://www.ukmonster.co.uk/monster/s...t=58330&page=2). And most apps need a second or so to register the frequency so pluck once and let the frequency settle before trying again (rather than constantly strumming it). Hope that helps.

10-05-2020, 01:05 PM	#28
350TSS Too much time on my hands member Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Shipbourne Bike: M900 Posts: 1,419	so Slob - if it was right on the app and wrong on the Allen key what would you do?

10-05-2020, 01:30 PM	#29
slob . Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: East London Bike: Multiple Monsters Posts: 9,710	with less experience, recheck both ways but ultimately trust the allen keys, the problem with the app is not the ultimate reading, it’s consistency

11-05-2020, 03:18 AM	#30
350TSS Too much time on my hands member Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Shipbourne Bike: M900 Posts: 1,419	So if you trust the allen keys you do not need the app?