Alternative headlamps... - Page 7

utopia · 29-01-2017, 09:44 AM

That link didn't work for me .. but the original one listed earlier does.

For the sake of being able to refer to it via a snappy, one word title rather than a lengthy description, shall we call this one the "Autopal" unit ?
That's what is written on the lens.
.... Gazza was kind enough to let me have the spare unit from his "car pair".

You're correct Gazza .. the bulb shield thingy can't be removed without damaging it.
If you're wary of removing yours, I'm happy to remove mine .. once I've tried it in standard trim.

Looking at the pics of the Wipac unit that Jerry listed, I notice that its "crystal" style reflector is similar in appearance to the Autopal unit, but differs in that it has more flutes in it (15 compared to 10) and these extend over the full reflector surface whereas the Autopal reflector has some plain areas.
One might assume that this will make it more effective at modulating its beam.
Closer inspection suggests that the greater complexity of the Wipac reflector is allowed by the fact that it is moulded plastic rather than metallic.
It also looks as if the crystal facets in the Wipac might be slightly curved rather than flat as in the Autopal, which also might be assumed to give better beam modulation .. otherwise why bother ?
At the price, the Wipac looks like it might prove to be a decent option.

We have rain forecast here over the next couple of days, but that should wash away the salt a bit so I'm hopeful of getting out for a test by Wednesday.

Mr Gazza · 29-01-2017, 11:57 AM

I think I will be leaving the bulb shield alone for now as there seems to be two different design philosophies going on here, regarding bulb shields and number of facets.

I think with fewer facets, as on the Autopal, that it needs more bulb power to melt the facet zones into one beam, maybe the Wipac will be more effective with less powerful bulbs, but possibly run into trouble with brighter bulbs as the lack of bulb shield will cause dazzle problems... probably?

I must say that the Wipac (Wico-Pacy) unit looks like a more thought about design and already has the correct terminals on the pilot light to plug and play.
It's priced exactly the same as the Autopal when bought as a single unit without bulb.

I don't mind a plastic reflector, but I hope the lens is glass... Plastic ones degrade over time and scratch easily, especially when removing the Summer chitin.

I found this very interesting selection.

https://parts.loc8apart.co.uk/nav/au...Assemblies.php

Hope the link works.

jerry · 29-01-2017, 04:46 PM

dont forget the good old Cibie/ Valeo H180 that is always a good quality option but more expensive than wipac

Mr Gazza · 31-01-2017, 08:18 PM

I have revised the kit with different clips which do away with the ply "segments".

The kit is now simpler, lighter and has a fewer parts count.

The legs are longer on these ones, so only 5 will fit in, instead of 6 of the previous type, it's still a nice firm, positive job.
Note how one clip easily spans over one of the "car" fitting lugs.

Still 2 kits left, ready for dispatch @ £5 each posted.

utopia · 31-01-2017, 10:10 PM

That's looking super-neat now.
If the posh MDF is as good as you say it is, then this latest set-up should be a long term proposition.
Ok, it might be nice to have the adaptor ring made out of something self-coloured that didn't need a paint finish, but that's just about the only nit one could pick with it now.
And the price is a killer !
Top job.

alan s4 · 01-02-2017, 07:29 AM

I'll take one Gazza, PM sent.......

Mr Gazza · 01-02-2017, 04:42 PM

Thanks Alan, you also have a pm.
I have also received 2 more orders, so that's all the adapters gone and one on the waiting list.
I will need to acquire more material for another batch and I think that the adapters will work out at about £10-£15 each at cost to club members, with a possible flame polished Delrin option (Pending experiments), in any colour you like so long as it's black.

Please register your interest if you would like one, so I can get an idea of how much stuff to buy.

Thanks... The future is bright...

jerry · 01-02-2017, 04:58 PM

This has to be one of the most awesome life affirming heart warming co-operative ,positive threads ever

alan s4 · 01-02-2017, 05:30 PM

I have a confession to make......I'm a total light tart. I'm not doing this for improved illumination, I just want fancy daytime running light things, I'm a sucker for them you see.

I bought my car purely on the basis of it having sweeping indicators and nice lights

Mr Gazza · 01-02-2017, 05:34 PM

.... Tart rings are extra...

Mr Gazza · 02-02-2017, 07:12 PM

Just had another couple of little test rides.

First was as before, with Osram Nightbreaker unlimited bulb, just to get my eye in.
Strangely the light didn't seem quite as good as I had remembered from a few nights ago, but then it is a bit damper tonight, and so the roads are a little darker... A fair bit more mud about too...

Next I tried my new Philips Extreme Vision bulb.
Well there's not really much to chose between them. The colour is about the same.
If anything the Philips seems to have a bit more reach on main and slightly more spread of light in the fore ground, making it easy to see what's on the road, about to go under the wheels.
The shady patch that I mentioned before, close to the bike on the right, is much better filled, so overall the main beam pattern is better with the Philips, but there's really not very much in it.

Dip is not so good. The pattern is broken up very close to the bike, with patches of shade.
There is a nice flying saucer shaped area of light ahead and a nice cut off as with the Osram, but the fill of light isn't as good as the Osram.
The nearside illumination seems more focused in one zone just below the cut off, at the expense of the area near the bike. It doesn't seem to inspire confidence in the same way as the Osram when vehicles approach.

Neither are bad bulbs at all, especially when compared to the standard set up. I am surprised at how different the patterns are in the same Autopal reflector.
I think I prefer the Osram for it's luxurious dip beam pattern, even if the Philips does just have the edge on main.
The Osram is quite a bit cheaper than the Philips too, so it comes out on top for the moment, in this reflector at any rate.

alan s4 · 01-03-2017, 06:04 PM

So, I now have my adaptor kit and clips (thanks again Gazza), time to get on with project "led light tart".

Found this on Ebay - UK seller and around half the price of the CREED item that kicked this thread off in the 1st place. Before I click "buy it now" can someone confirm it will work...I'm an electrical neanderthal.....crimping is something my wife did with her hair in the 80's.

Is it wishful thinking/hoping that this would be plug and play??

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/7-Universa...wAAOSwImRYdzEy

Mr Gazza · 01-03-2017, 07:29 PM

It has H4 plugs and sockets so it all looks plug and play to me, though quite what you plug where is a bit of a mystery. I am sure there will be instructions?

There is also a piece of harness that you won't need, for vehicles with another bulb type, so no need to worry about that.

My only concern would be getting it all inside the shell. That large box (driver?) may have to reside outside the shell.

I am very keen to find out if the adapter fits it properly.

02-03-2017, 10:51 AM

It's the headlight from the new Monster 1200 S that you need. Very crisps edge to the beam pattern, quite bright, strong high beam and a daytime running light.

Although the headlight comes in a pack with a lot of other bits attached.. engine, wheels, etc.

utopia · 02-03-2017, 11:23 AM

That's ok.
We like engines.
And wheels ... as long as there are only two of them.

29-01-2017, 11:57 AM	#92
Mr Gazza Lord of the Rings Join Date: May 2013 Location: Norwich Bike: M900sie Posts: 5,814	I think I will be leaving the bulb shield alone for now as there seems to be two different design philosophies going on here, regarding bulb shields and number of facets. I think with fewer facets, as on the Autopal, that it needs more bulb power to melt the facet zones into one beam, maybe the Wipac will be more effective with less powerful bulbs, but possibly run into trouble with brighter bulbs as the lack of bulb shield will cause dazzle problems... probably? I must say that the Wipac (Wico-Pacy) unit looks like a more thought about design and already has the correct terminals on the pilot light to plug and play. It's priced exactly the same as the Autopal when bought as a single unit without bulb. I don't mind a plastic reflector, but I hope the lens is glass... Plastic ones degrade over time and scratch easily, especially when removing the Summer chitin. I found this very interesting selection. https://parts.loc8apart.co.uk/nav/au...Assemblies.php Hope the link works. __________________

29-01-2017, 04:46 PM	#93
jerry Old Git Join Date: May 2006 Location: Cricklade Bike: Multiple Monsters Posts: 2,822	dont forget the good old Cibie/ Valeo H180 that is always a good quality option but more expensive than wipac __________________ MONSTERMAN

31-01-2017, 08:18 PM	#94
Mr Gazza Lord of the Rings Join Date: May 2013 Location: Norwich Bike: M900sie Posts: 5,814	Kit revision I have revised the kit with different clips which do away with the ply "segments". The kit is now simpler, lighter and has a fewer parts count. The legs are longer on these ones, so only 5 will fit in, instead of 6 of the previous type, it's still a nice firm, positive job. Note how one clip easily spans over one of the "car" fitting lugs. Still 2 kits left, ready for dispatch @ £5 each posted. __________________

01-02-2017, 04:42 PM	#97
Mr Gazza Lord of the Rings Join Date: May 2013 Location: Norwich Bike: M900sie Posts: 5,814	Thanks Alan, you also have a pm. I have also received 2 more orders, so that's all the adapters gone and one on the waiting list. I will need to acquire more material for another batch and I think that the adapters will work out at about £10-£15 each at cost to club members, with a possible flame polished Delrin option (Pending experiments), in any colour you like so long as it's black. Please register your interest if you would like one, so I can get an idea of how much stuff to buy. Thanks... The future is bright... __________________

01-02-2017, 04:58 PM	#98
jerry Old Git Join Date: May 2006 Location: Cricklade Bike: Multiple Monsters Posts: 2,822	This has to be one of the most awesome life affirming heart warming co-operative ,positive threads ever __________________ MONSTERMAN

29-01-2017, 09:44 AM	#91
utopia No turn left unstoned Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: leicester Bike: M750 Posts: 4,545	That link didn't work for me .. but the original one listed earlier does. For the sake of being able to refer to it via a snappy, one word title rather than a lengthy description, shall we call this one the "Autopal" unit ? That's what is written on the lens. .... Gazza was kind enough to let me have the spare unit from his "car pair". You're correct Gazza .. the bulb shield thingy can't be removed without damaging it. If you're wary of removing yours, I'm happy to remove mine .. once I've tried it in standard trim. Looking at the pics of the Wipac unit that Jerry listed, I notice that its "crystal" style reflector is similar in appearance to the Autopal unit, but differs in that it has more flutes in it (15 compared to 10) and these extend over the full reflector surface whereas the Autopal reflector has some plain areas. One might assume that this will make it more effective at modulating its beam. Closer inspection suggests that the greater complexity of the Wipac reflector is allowed by the fact that it is moulded plastic rather than metallic. It also looks as if the crystal facets in the Wipac might be slightly curved rather than flat as in the Autopal, which also might be assumed to give better beam modulation .. otherwise why bother ? At the price, the Wipac looks like it might prove to be a decent option. We have rain forecast here over the next couple of days, but that should wash away the salt a bit so I'm hopeful of getting out for a test by Wednesday.

31-01-2017, 10:10 PM	#95
utopia No turn left unstoned Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: leicester Bike: M750 Posts: 4,545	That's looking super-neat now. If the posh MDF is as good as you say it is, then this latest set-up should be a long term proposition. Ok, it might be nice to have the adaptor ring made out of something self-coloured that didn't need a paint finish, but that's just about the only nit one could pick with it now. And the price is a killer ! Top job.

01-02-2017, 07:29 AM	#96
alan s4 Registered User Join Date: Sep 2013 Location: Glasgow Bike: S4 challenge Posts: 447	I'll take one Gazza, PM sent.......

01-02-2017, 05:30 PM	#99
alan s4 Registered User Join Date: Sep 2013 Location: Glasgow Bike: S4 challenge Posts: 447	I have a confession to make......I'm a total light tart. I'm not doing this for improved illumination, I just want fancy daytime running light things, I'm a sucker for them you see. I bought my car purely on the basis of it having sweeping indicators and nice lights

01-02-2017, 05:34 PM	#100
Mr Gazza Lord of the Rings Join Date: May 2013 Location: Norwich Bike: M900sie Posts: 5,814	.... Tart rings are extra... __________________

02-02-2017, 07:12 PM	#101
Mr Gazza Lord of the Rings Join Date: May 2013 Location: Norwich Bike: M900sie Posts: 5,814	Just had another couple of little test rides. First was as before, with Osram Nightbreaker unlimited bulb, just to get my eye in. Strangely the light didn't seem quite as good as I had remembered from a few nights ago, but then it is a bit damper tonight, and so the roads are a little darker... A fair bit more mud about too... Next I tried my new Philips Extreme Vision bulb. Well there's not really much to chose between them. The colour is about the same. If anything the Philips seems to have a bit more reach on main and slightly more spread of light in the fore ground, making it easy to see what's on the road, about to go under the wheels. The shady patch that I mentioned before, close to the bike on the right, is much better filled, so overall the main beam pattern is better with the Philips, but there's really not very much in it. Dip is not so good. The pattern is broken up very close to the bike, with patches of shade. There is a nice flying saucer shaped area of light ahead and a nice cut off as with the Osram, but the fill of light isn't as good as the Osram. The nearside illumination seems more focused in one zone just below the cut off, at the expense of the area near the bike. It doesn't seem to inspire confidence in the same way as the Osram when vehicles approach. Neither are bad bulbs at all, especially when compared to the standard set up. I am surprised at how different the patterns are in the same Autopal reflector. I think I prefer the Osram for it's luxurious dip beam pattern, even if the Philips does just have the edge on main. The Osram is quite a bit cheaper than the Philips too, so it comes out on top for the moment, in this reflector at any rate. __________________

01-03-2017, 06:04 PM	#102
alan s4 Registered User Join Date: Sep 2013 Location: Glasgow Bike: S4 challenge Posts: 447	So, I now have my adaptor kit and clips (thanks again Gazza), time to get on with project "led light tart". Found this on Ebay - UK seller and around half the price of the CREED item that kicked this thread off in the 1st place. Before I click "buy it now" can someone confirm it will work...I'm an electrical neanderthal.....crimping is something my wife did with her hair in the 80's. Is it wishful thinking/hoping that this would be plug and play?? http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/7-Universa...wAAOSwImRYdzEy

01-03-2017, 07:29 PM	#103
Mr Gazza Lord of the Rings Join Date: May 2013 Location: Norwich Bike: M900sie Posts: 5,814	It has H4 plugs and sockets so it all looks plug and play to me, though quite what you plug where is a bit of a mystery. I am sure there will be instructions? There is also a piece of harness that you won't need, for vehicles with another bulb type, so no need to worry about that. My only concern would be getting it all inside the shell. That large box (driver?) may have to reside outside the shell. I am very keen to find out if the adapter fits it properly. __________________

02-03-2017, 10:51 AM	#104
LTDUK Guest Posts: n/a	It's the headlight from the new Monster 1200 S that you need. Very crisps edge to the beam pattern, quite bright, strong high beam and a daytime running light. Although the headlight comes in a pack with a lot of other bits attached.. engine, wheels, etc.

02-03-2017, 11:23 AM	#105
utopia No turn left unstoned Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: leicester Bike: M750 Posts: 4,545	That's ok. We like engines. And wheels ... as long as there are only two of them.