Slow Monster rebuild - Page 6

Darren69 · 07-03-2017, 11:14 AM

You have to make sure the stud doesn't turn with the nut, otherwise you'll break the wires inside and the starter will be scrap.

Darren69 · 07-03-2017, 11:15 AM

oh, you've cut it off, that was wise.

350TSS · 07-03-2017, 11:23 AM

Motor then stripped down. The circlip holding the pinion on has the smallest set of eyes I have ever seen. My circlip pliers would not fit and I did not want to grind down a perfectly serviceable set for this one job so it was out with two electrical screwdrivers. A half hour later the circlip finally came off but not before I had stabbed myself 3 times.
Picture below shows stripped motor with bloodstains on the pinion end casting.
Brushes still have some but not very much meat on them. The bike is only likely to be used for sunny summer blasts so they can go back.
]https://s4.postimg.org/l3r7xeist/Starter_motor_stripped.jpg[/img][/url]upload gambar

350TSS · 07-03-2017, 11:26 AM

upload gambar

350TSS · 07-03-2017, 11:40 AM

Armature was then tested for continuity and the commutator polished up with 800 grade wet and dry.
Re-assembly is a definitely three handed job, one to inset the armature into the brush end cap and two electrical screwdrivers to hold back the brushes until they are engaged on the commutator (after the end cap bearing had a small dollop of HMP grease and the ball race and seal at the pinion end was similarly treated.
There are registers on the pinion end cap and the armature case which line up. oddly the registers on the brush end cap cannot line up with the other two registers which took me about 15 minutes to work out . In the end there is only one way it can go back together. If I ever strip one again I will paint registers on both end caps and the armature case before I strip it.

Body was re-sprayed with PJ1 whilst it was stripped.

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350TSS · 07-03-2017, 11:53 AM

Further filling of the underside of the tank has also been done this week. This is going to take a long time because a) the convoluted shape means that power sanding tools cannot be used easily and b) I am concerned there is not enough clearance between the front seat support on the frame and the bottom of the tank. Also I discovered that to get the tank off it has to be tilted backwards and the act of tilting it causes other clearance problems at the front. Unfortunately I think I need to remove about 8mm from the section where it is plywood laminated about 50mm deep and I cannot get any sort of saw in there without threatening the nicely sanded top surface.

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350TSS · 07-03-2017, 11:57 AM

Need to get out into the garage now

350TSS · 14-03-2017, 02:50 PM

2 steps forward one backwards
With some warmer weather I was able to take the tank plug out of the garage and sand down the base. Sanding in the garage is a pain because the dust gets absolutely everywhere.

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350TSS · 14-03-2017, 05:14 PM

Whilst waiting for the P38 on the tank base to go off I thought I would tackle a job I have been putting off, namely the oil cooler mount to the rocker cover. When I took the oil cooler off to refurbish it one of the rubber mounts parted company from the washer and stud that screws into the rocker cover casting. I was going to renew them anyway but when I tried to remove the threaded portion from the casting the threaded part sheared in the casting about 4mm below the face of the casting. the end of the sheared thread was of course not smooth but extremely jagged and therefore not good for starting a drill into. The shape and dimensions of the casting meant it was impossible to mount the casting into a machine vice so that a pillar drill could be used, - it had to be held in the bench vice and a hand held 18v battery drill used
For the last two months every time I saw it I sprayed it with penetrating oil in the hope it would come out easily. I had 2 options drill a 3mm hole in the sheared stud to put an ease-it-out in and hopefully save the thread in the casting or drill it 6mm then 7 mm and re-tap the hole 8mm, but I was not certain I could get a male /female vibration damper with an 8mm male thread. The ease-it-out option was chosen and a 3mm ease-it out tried but it would not budge and I was frightened of breaking the ease-it-out in the sheared stud. I then tried a 4mm hole and larger ease-it-out was threaded in. the results are in the pictures below.

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350TSS · 14-03-2017, 05:29 PM

This is not a complete disaster as the current position of the oil cooler, hung from the top of the front head, puts it in a place that is potentially getting very congested with battery boxes and coil enclosures. Also in this position the oil cooler is effectively pre- heating the air flow to the carbs. I prefer the 900SS position mounted off the lower rocker cover such that the "exhaust" air from the cooler is passed over the front exhaust header pipe. This position also has the advantage of less convoluted oil pipe runs but suffers from the disadvantage of the requirement to provide some form of protection against flints and stones coming off the front tyre.
Tomorrow I shall convert the above broken casting into a "standard" rocker cover with the aid of a hacksaw and an orbital sander and devise a method of hanging the oil cooler off a bracket secured to the front most screws holding the lower rocker cover to the forward facing head.

slob · 14-03-2017, 06:13 PM

I brazed up a simple bracket for mine and used longer cover bolts

LouSCannon · 15-03-2017, 08:26 AM

Now watching this thread with interest given as I'm about to start stripping my old M900 this year...

350TSS · 16-03-2017, 09:26 AM

Your oil cooler mount is very neat and it is almost certainly much easier to mount than my effort. I like the triangular oil cooler. Here is mine. I cut down some stainless bolts to get the ss studding and turned down 2 ss mounting nuts (from Screwfix), then drilled and tapped some 12mm aluminium bar and then wasted it on the model lathe so that the nuts holding it to the studding could be accessed. Getting the stud length dead right took 2 attempts.

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slob · 16-03-2017, 10:22 AM

Good work Richard

350TSS · 23-03-2017, 10:01 AM

After what we thought was spring it has turned cold again so no resin pouring for this week. I'm pottering about looking for jobs to move the bike forward. I bought a small lathe last year and am trying to learn how to use it , I last touched one in metalwork class over 50 years ago so I have a lot to learn. I plan on machining a carrier for the rear brake caliper to permit a fully floating parallelogram rear brake. This will involve machining to interference tolerances so I need to get some practice.
Making some threaded aluminium plugs to go in the frame rails at the back seemed to be a good start. I bought some 25mm aluminium bar from Aluminium Warehouse (good supplier and remarkably reasonably priced). The plugs would be about 25mm long turned down for 4mm to match the frame rail OD (22mm) and turned down again for 21mm to c18mm to be an interference fit in the frame rail. These would be drilled and tapped 6mm to provide a mounting point for the seat or the number plate.
I put the bar in the 3 jaw chuck and at the other end had a pointed taper to centralise the work piece and I turned the lathe on to check for run out.

BANG!!!! whirrrrrrrrrrr!!! Ooops!!!!
At first I thought I had stripped a drive gear on the lathe. Turns out I had left the tool post too close to the 3 jaw chuck and when I pressed the start switch one jaw smacked into the cutting tool in the tool post stopping everything dead. Fortunately it only snapped the toothed belt drive not the helical driving gears. No more lathe work until a new belt is delivered.
I thought I would strip and clean the vacuum fuel pump instead. There 2 bolts holding it on via top hat washers and a rubber grommets through c 15mm holes in lugs on the frame. The bottom one was seized with the top hat washer having welded itself to the bolt through corrosion.

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07-03-2017, 11:14 AM	#76
Darren69 Transmaniacon MOC Join Date: Sep 2013 Location: Sutton In Ashfield Bike: Multiple Monsters Posts: 6,095	You have to make sure the stud doesn't turn with the nut, otherwise you'll break the wires inside and the starter will be scrap. __________________ Roast Beef Monster! Termignoni and Bucci - Italian for pipe and slippers! S4 Fogarty, S4R 07T, 748, Series 1 Mirage

07-03-2017, 11:15 AM	#77
Darren69 Transmaniacon MOC Join Date: Sep 2013 Location: Sutton In Ashfield Bike: Multiple Monsters Posts: 6,095	oh, you've cut it off, that was wise. __________________ Roast Beef Monster! Termignoni and Bucci - Italian for pipe and slippers! S4 Fogarty, S4R 07T, 748, Series 1 Mirage

15-03-2017, 08:26 AM	#87
LouSCannon These must fit a Monster? Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Stockton Heath Bike: Multiple Monsters Posts: 1,036	Now watching this thread with interest given as I'm about to start stripping my old M900 this year... __________________ "Sometimes it takes a whole tankful of fuel before you can think straight."

07-03-2017, 11:23 AM	#78
350TSS Too much time on my hands member Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Shipbourne Bike: M900 Posts: 1,422	Motor then stripped down. The circlip holding the pinion on has the smallest set of eyes I have ever seen. My circlip pliers would not fit and I did not want to grind down a perfectly serviceable set for this one job so it was out with two electrical screwdrivers. A half hour later the circlip finally came off but not before I had stabbed myself 3 times. Picture below shows stripped motor with bloodstains on the pinion end casting. Brushes still have some but not very much meat on them. The bike is only likely to be used for sunny summer blasts so they can go back. ]https://s4.postimg.org/l3r7xeist/Starter_motor_stripped.jpg[/img][/url]upload gambar

07-03-2017, 11:26 AM	#79
350TSS Too much time on my hands member Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Shipbourne Bike: M900 Posts: 1,422	upload gambar

07-03-2017, 11:40 AM	#80
350TSS Too much time on my hands member Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Shipbourne Bike: M900 Posts: 1,422	Armature was then tested for continuity and the commutator polished up with 800 grade wet and dry. Re-assembly is a definitely three handed job, one to inset the armature into the brush end cap and two electrical screwdrivers to hold back the brushes until they are engaged on the commutator (after the end cap bearing had a small dollop of HMP grease and the ball race and seal at the pinion end was similarly treated. There are registers on the pinion end cap and the armature case which line up. oddly the registers on the brush end cap cannot line up with the other two registers which took me about 15 minutes to work out . In the end there is only one way it can go back together. If I ever strip one again I will paint registers on both end caps and the armature case before I strip it. Body was re-sprayed with PJ1 whilst it was stripped. picture host

07-03-2017, 11:53 AM	#81
350TSS Too much time on my hands member Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Shipbourne Bike: M900 Posts: 1,422	Further filling of the underside of the tank has also been done this week. This is going to take a long time because a) the convoluted shape means that power sanding tools cannot be used easily and b) I am concerned there is not enough clearance between the front seat support on the frame and the bottom of the tank. Also I discovered that to get the tank off it has to be tilted backwards and the act of tilting it causes other clearance problems at the front. Unfortunately I think I need to remove about 8mm from the section where it is plywood laminated about 50mm deep and I cannot get any sort of saw in there without threatening the nicely sanded top surface. gif upload upload a gif

07-03-2017, 11:57 AM	#82
350TSS Too much time on my hands member Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Shipbourne Bike: M900 Posts: 1,422	Need to get out into the garage now

14-03-2017, 02:50 PM	#83
350TSS Too much time on my hands member Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Shipbourne Bike: M900 Posts: 1,422	2 steps forward one backwards With some warmer weather I was able to take the tank plug out of the garage and sand down the base. Sanding in the garage is a pain because the dust gets absolutely everywhere. upload gambar free photo hosting

14-03-2017, 05:14 PM	#84
350TSS Too much time on my hands member Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Shipbourne Bike: M900 Posts: 1,422	Whilst waiting for the P38 on the tank base to go off I thought I would tackle a job I have been putting off, namely the oil cooler mount to the rocker cover. When I took the oil cooler off to refurbish it one of the rubber mounts parted company from the washer and stud that screws into the rocker cover casting. I was going to renew them anyway but when I tried to remove the threaded portion from the casting the threaded part sheared in the casting about 4mm below the face of the casting. the end of the sheared thread was of course not smooth but extremely jagged and therefore not good for starting a drill into. The shape and dimensions of the casting meant it was impossible to mount the casting into a machine vice so that a pillar drill could be used, - it had to be held in the bench vice and a hand held 18v battery drill used For the last two months every time I saw it I sprayed it with penetrating oil in the hope it would come out easily. I had 2 options drill a 3mm hole in the sheared stud to put an ease-it-out in and hopefully save the thread in the casting or drill it 6mm then 7 mm and re-tap the hole 8mm, but I was not certain I could get a male /female vibration damper with an 8mm male thread. The ease-it-out option was chosen and a 3mm ease-it out tried but it would not budge and I was frightened of breaking the ease-it-out in the sheared stud. I then tried a 4mm hole and larger ease-it-out was threaded in. the results are in the pictures below. free upload image upload pictures free

14-03-2017, 05:29 PM	#85
350TSS Too much time on my hands member Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Shipbourne Bike: M900 Posts: 1,422	This is not a complete disaster as the current position of the oil cooler, hung from the top of the front head, puts it in a place that is potentially getting very congested with battery boxes and coil enclosures. Also in this position the oil cooler is effectively pre- heating the air flow to the carbs. I prefer the 900SS position mounted off the lower rocker cover such that the "exhaust" air from the cooler is passed over the front exhaust header pipe. This position also has the advantage of less convoluted oil pipe runs but suffers from the disadvantage of the requirement to provide some form of protection against flints and stones coming off the front tyre. Tomorrow I shall convert the above broken casting into a "standard" rocker cover with the aid of a hacksaw and an orbital sander and devise a method of hanging the oil cooler off a bracket secured to the front most screws holding the lower rocker cover to the forward facing head.

14-03-2017, 06:13 PM	#86
slob . Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: East London Bike: Multiple Monsters Posts: 9,736	I brazed up a simple bracket for mine and used longer cover bolts

16-03-2017, 09:26 AM	#88
350TSS Too much time on my hands member Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Shipbourne Bike: M900 Posts: 1,422	Your oil cooler mount is very neat and it is almost certainly much easier to mount than my effort. I like the triangular oil cooler. Here is mine. I cut down some stainless bolts to get the ss studding and turned down 2 ss mounting nuts (from Screwfix), then drilled and tapped some 12mm aluminium bar and then wasted it on the model lathe so that the nuts holding it to the studding could be accessed. Getting the stud length dead right took 2 attempts. image uploader

16-03-2017, 10:22 AM	#89
slob . Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: East London Bike: Multiple Monsters Posts: 9,736	Good work Richard

23-03-2017, 10:01 AM	#90
350TSS Too much time on my hands member Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Shipbourne Bike: M900 Posts: 1,422	After what we thought was spring it has turned cold again so no resin pouring for this week. I'm pottering about looking for jobs to move the bike forward. I bought a small lathe last year and am trying to learn how to use it , I last touched one in metalwork class over 50 years ago so I have a lot to learn. I plan on machining a carrier for the rear brake caliper to permit a fully floating parallelogram rear brake. This will involve machining to interference tolerances so I need to get some practice. Making some threaded aluminium plugs to go in the frame rails at the back seemed to be a good start. I bought some 25mm aluminium bar from Aluminium Warehouse (good supplier and remarkably reasonably priced). The plugs would be about 25mm long turned down for 4mm to match the frame rail OD (22mm) and turned down again for 21mm to c18mm to be an interference fit in the frame rail. These would be drilled and tapped 6mm to provide a mounting point for the seat or the number plate. I put the bar in the 3 jaw chuck and at the other end had a pointed taper to centralise the work piece and I turned the lathe on to check for run out. BANG!!!! whirrrrrrrrrrr!!! Ooops!!!! At first I thought I had stripped a drive gear on the lathe. Turns out I had left the tool post too close to the 3 jaw chuck and when I pressed the start switch one jaw smacked into the cutting tool in the tool post stopping everything dead. Fortunately it only snapped the toothed belt drive not the helical driving gears. No more lathe work until a new belt is delivered. I thought I would strip and clean the vacuum fuel pump instead. There 2 bolts holding it on via top hat washers and a rubber grommets through c 15mm holes in lugs on the frame. The bottom one was seized with the top hat washer having welded itself to the bolt through corrosion. photo uploading websites host image online post images print screen windows click image upload