1999 M600 has been sitting for 5 years - what to do? - Page 3

jamminbmx · 26-02-2020, 10:45 AM

Yeah thats what I'm scared of - having to replace tap and rebuild pump! Can I replace the tap with a manual one? I would prefer that.

Mr Gazza · 26-02-2020, 10:50 AM

If you are re-commissioning and will probably only fill the tank immediately prior to a start up, I think there will be little chance of any fuel entering the crankcases. Once you have her up and running there is a (small) chance it could happen, but only after a fairly prolonged stand, say a couple of weeks.
I have the habit of just pulling the bike level and glancing at the oil level window before each cold start, that simple practice should give you all the warning you need, to save from detonating the whole shebang!

Manual tap sounds like a good idea.

jamminbmx · 26-02-2020, 11:29 AM

It had been standing for 5 years with old fuel it. Tank now removed. Checked the oil level and it is not full - about 80% - So have not filled crankcase with fuel at least.

Will remove plugs and put a bit of oil in then first quick crank with no plugs as suggested. Then put new plugs back and crank it til hopefully fuel gets all the way to cylinders and I ride off into the sunset! Or the horizontal rainstorm more likely this weekend!

Flip · 26-02-2020, 09:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jamminbmx

Yeah thats what I'm scared of - having to replace tap and rebuild pump! Can I replace the tap with a manual one? I would prefer that.

There's nothing really scary about it, especially as you'll be working in that area changing the fuel filter etc. and it really would be a good idea to make sure the fuel and vacuum pipes are not perishing.

A genuine Ducati vacuum tap cost me £28 a couple of years ago but I know someone on here replaced theirs with a generic one but had to make a bracket to get it to fit.

Obviously you could replace it with a manual tap if you prefer and in fact some early bikes were fitted with them and although genuine ones are no longer available apparently there are still some NOS available but obviously you could fit a generic type in it's place.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Ducati-OE...IAAOSweh9eQt6m

And the re-build kits for the Mikuni vacuum pump from Allens Performance are £20

I know it can seem a bit endless until it's sorted but once done at least it's peace of mind when you're out and about on the bike- the worst thing is if it lets you down and you can never really trust it enough to go places and enjoy it.

jamminbmx · 27-02-2020, 07:47 AM

Thanks for the info! You're right. Not that scary. 50 quid is not nearly as back as I expected to get those two bits working.

What fuel hose and vacuum hoses do you guys use? Do you buy Ducati ready made sections, or cut to size from a long length? Do you know what size?

27-02-2020, 09:05 AM

Another option for a new tap is an electric one. I fitted one to the VX800 because their vacuum taps were legendary for filling the sump with fuel. An advantage is that it gets the fuel to the pump as soon as the ignition is turned on, rather than having to wait for vacuum from spinning the motor. I'm sure they were quite inexpensive, not being dedicated to only motorcycles.

manwithredbike · 27-02-2020, 10:16 AM

jmminbmx, I've been through the whole fuel tap thing recently, see thread below.
http://www.ukmonster.co.uk/monster/s...ad.php?t=58052

The vacuum tap is easily checked. You can blow through it from the inlet side and it should'nt pass any wind

if it does then it is prob shot and will allow petrol to reach the carbs when the engine is not running. If it seems ok and not passing, you can also check that it's working by disconnecting the outlet fuel line, connecting the inlet fuel line from the tank/filter, connecting the vacuum pipe to the manifold and turning over the engine (pull the plugs out first). It should spurt petrol from the outlet spout with each revolution of the engine (put a rag under it or you'll have petrol spurting over the engine).
In my case, the float valve in the carb was also sticking open and it filled the front cylinder and crankcase.
I fitted a new non ducati vacuum tap which cost around £6 with a simple home made bracket. I also fitted an in-line fuel tap between the filter and the vacuum tap. just as a belt and braces.

jamminbmx · 27-02-2020, 10:59 AM

Cheers! Sounds like a good test to do before I plumb it all in! Your previous thread answers all other questions I was about to ask!

Bring on the weekend!

Graham04 · 27-02-2020, 03:51 PM

In an earlier thread you said you have new standard plugs. My 600 had a big service a few months before I bought it. It was a pig to start and would never tick over. The previous owner bought all the parts from Wemoto. I struggled with it for ages cleaning and balancing carbs. when I eventually got back to the plugs, they were completely the wrong ones NGK DPR6EA plus the gap was too big. I replaced them the with DCPR8E plugs that seem to be recommended in the forum . It now starts with one touch of the button and ticks over in traffic . Wemoto don't give the NGK number just supply their version of a standard plug . Just in case that is where you got them from.
By the way mine is a 95 and it come complete with a fuel tap although I have never turned it off.

jamminbmx · 28-02-2020, 08:08 AM

Graham - Wemoto obviously heard you! They sent me DCPR8E. Cheers for the tip!

28-02-2020, 07:02 PM

I’m not sure if anyone has suggested but I would change the oil pressure switch as well or buy one and carry it with you as when they go they go in style oil all over the back tyre I’m talking from experience it happened to me twice in one year buy genuine as well rather than buying the Vauxhall’s one that fits most Ducati’s good luck with your bike.

the lodger · 28-02-2020, 07:24 PM

If you do turn the motor over on the starter with the plugs out , do remember to the earth the plugs ( or better may be to just turn the motor by hand )

jamminbmx · 29-02-2020, 01:51 PM

Update time:

- New HiFlo air filter
- New HiFlo oil filter and oil
- New plugs
- New Motobatt battery
- New Exact belts. Tensioner bolts were way tight! WD40 and let them sit for an hour - was worried about rounding them.
- Cranked it with plugs out after adding a bit of oil to top end. Turned over nicely

New Oberon clutch cylinder. Installed it with the extension piece. You could feel the spring being compressed as the 3 bolts were tightened so not sure if I really needed that bit. Bled it (took ages!) and will try it on the road hopefully.

Now just need fuel...I hope

Only slight issue is the fuel hoses. 1 length from tank to filter and 1 length from filter to vacuum tap. Both quite long and really struggling to tuck them up under the tank...was thinking of making them way shorter...what do you think?

Cheers!

slob · 29-02-2020, 02:02 PM

the fuel hoses are famous for kinking and causing fuel starvation, i’m not sure shortening them will help. getting them routed back into s smooth loop should be the answer

29-02-2020, 02:17 PM

As Rob says, Monster fuel pipes do have a tendency to kink as you drop the tank. Mine certainly did on the M750.

Re the Oberon clutch slave, I'd suggest you whip it off pretty quick and measure the free length of the exposed push-rod. Oberon suggest the go/no-go length is about 30mm for adding the extension. The reason it's important is, of course, that if there is excessive preload on the rod, you can say goodbye to the clutch release bearing and probably the slave too, not to mention provoking clutch slip.

Otherwise, it's looking good!

Nick

26-02-2020, 10:50 AM	#32
Mr Gazza Lord of the Rings Join Date: May 2013 Location: Norwich Bike: M900sie Posts: 5,963	If you are re-commissioning and will probably only fill the tank immediately prior to a start up, I think there will be little chance of any fuel entering the crankcases. Once you have her up and running there is a (small) chance it could happen, but only after a fairly prolonged stand, say a couple of weeks. I have the habit of just pulling the bike level and glancing at the oil level window before each cold start, that simple practice should give you all the warning you need, to save from detonating the whole shebang! Manual tap sounds like a good idea. __________________

27-02-2020, 10:16 AM	#37
manwithredbike aka Phil Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: derry Bike: M900 Posts: 376	jmminbmx, I've been through the whole fuel tap thing recently, see thread below. http://www.ukmonster.co.uk/monster/s...ad.php?t=58052 The vacuum tap is easily checked. You can blow through it from the inlet side and it should'nt pass any wind if it does then it is prob shot and will allow petrol to reach the carbs when the engine is not running. If it seems ok and not passing, you can also check that it's working by disconnecting the outlet fuel line, connecting the inlet fuel line from the tank/filter, connecting the vacuum pipe to the manifold and turning over the engine (pull the plugs out first). It should spurt petrol from the outlet spout with each revolution of the engine (put a rag under it or you'll have petrol spurting over the engine). In my case, the float valve in the carb was also sticking open and it filled the front cylinder and crankcase. I fitted a new non ducati vacuum tap which cost around £6 with a simple home made bracket. I also fitted an in-line fuel tap between the filter and the vacuum tap. just as a belt and braces. __________________ .. ~

27-02-2020, 03:51 PM	#39
Graham04 Registered User Join Date: Aug 2019 Location: Swansea Bike: M620ie Posts: 15	In an earlier thread you said you have new standard plugs. My 600 had a big service a few months before I bought it. It was a pig to start and would never tick over. The previous owner bought all the parts from Wemoto. I struggled with it for ages cleaning and balancing carbs. when I eventually got back to the plugs, they were completely the wrong ones NGK DPR6EA plus the gap was too big. I replaced them the with DCPR8E plugs that seem to be recommended in the forum . It now starts with one touch of the button and ticks over in traffic . Wemoto don't give the NGK number just supply their version of a standard plug . Just in case that is where you got them from. By the way mine is a 95 and it come complete with a fuel tap although I have never turned it off. Last edited by Graham04; 27-02-2020 at 03:56 PM..

28-02-2020, 07:24 PM	#42
the lodger Registered User Join Date: Oct 2019 Location: Chorley Bike: M900 Posts: 160	If you do turn the motor over on the starter with the plugs out , do remember to the earth the plugs ( or better may be to just turn the motor by hand ) __________________ Contents may settle !

29-02-2020, 01:51 PM	#43
jamminbmx Registered User Join Date: Mar 2016 Location: oxford Bike: M600 Posts: 131	Update time: - New HiFlo air filter - New HiFlo oil filter and oil - New plugs - New Motobatt battery - New Exact belts. Tensioner bolts were way tight! WD40 and let them sit for an hour - was worried about rounding them. - Cranked it with plugs out after adding a bit of oil to top end. Turned over nicely New Oberon clutch cylinder. Installed it with the extension piece. You could feel the spring being compressed as the 3 bolts were tightened so not sure if I really needed that bit. Bled it (took ages!) and will try it on the road hopefully. Now just need fuel...I hope Only slight issue is the fuel hoses. 1 length from tank to filter and 1 length from filter to vacuum tap. Both quite long and really struggling to tuck them up under the tank...was thinking of making them way shorter...what do you think? Cheers! Last edited by jamminbmx; 29-02-2020 at 01:54 PM..

26-02-2020, 10:45 AM	#31
jamminbmx Registered User Join Date: Mar 2016 Location: oxford Bike: M600 Posts: 131	Yeah thats what I'm scared of - having to replace tap and rebuild pump! Can I replace the tap with a manual one? I would prefer that.

26-02-2020, 11:29 AM	#33
jamminbmx Registered User Join Date: Mar 2016 Location: oxford Bike: M600 Posts: 131	It had been standing for 5 years with old fuel it. Tank now removed. Checked the oil level and it is not full - about 80% - So have not filled crankcase with fuel at least. Will remove plugs and put a bit of oil in then first quick crank with no plugs as suggested. Then put new plugs back and crank it til hopefully fuel gets all the way to cylinders and I ride off into the sunset! Or the horizontal rainstorm more likely this weekend!

27-02-2020, 07:47 AM	#35
jamminbmx Registered User Join Date: Mar 2016 Location: oxford Bike: M600 Posts: 131	Thanks for the info! You're right. Not that scary. 50 quid is not nearly as back as I expected to get those two bits working. What fuel hose and vacuum hoses do you guys use? Do you buy Ducati ready made sections, or cut to size from a long length? Do you know what size?

27-02-2020, 09:05 AM	#36
The Clockie Guest Posts: n/a	Another option for a new tap is an electric one. I fitted one to the VX800 because their vacuum taps were legendary for filling the sump with fuel. An advantage is that it gets the fuel to the pump as soon as the ignition is turned on, rather than having to wait for vacuum from spinning the motor. I'm sure they were quite inexpensive, not being dedicated to only motorcycles.

27-02-2020, 10:59 AM	#38
jamminbmx Registered User Join Date: Mar 2016 Location: oxford Bike: M600 Posts: 131	Cheers! Sounds like a good test to do before I plumb it all in! Your previous thread answers all other questions I was about to ask! Bring on the weekend!

28-02-2020, 08:08 AM	#40
jamminbmx Registered User Join Date: Mar 2016 Location: oxford Bike: M600 Posts: 131	Graham - Wemoto obviously heard you! They sent me DCPR8E. Cheers for the tip!

28-02-2020, 07:02 PM	#41
FLATTOP Guest Posts: n/a	I’m not sure if anyone has suggested but I would change the oil pressure switch as well or buy one and carry it with you as when they go they go in style oil all over the back tyre I’m talking from experience it happened to me twice in one year buy genuine as well rather than buying the Vauxhall’s one that fits most Ducati’s good luck with your bike.

29-02-2020, 02:02 PM	#44
slob . Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: East London Bike: Multiple Monsters Posts: 9,733	the fuel hoses are famous for kinking and causing fuel starvation, i’m not sure shortening them will help. getting them routed back into s smooth loop should be the answer

29-02-2020, 02:17 PM	#45
The Clockie Guest Posts: n/a	As Rob says, Monster fuel pipes do have a tendency to kink as you drop the tank. Mine certainly did on the M750. Re the Oberon clutch slave, I'd suggest you whip it off pretty quick and measure the free length of the exposed push-rod. Oberon suggest the go/no-go length is about 30mm for adding the extension. The reason it's important is, of course, that if there is excessive preload on the rod, you can say goodbye to the clutch release bearing and probably the slave too, not to mention provoking clutch slip. Otherwise, it's looking good! Nick