Forks & Upgrades?

Jez900ie · 14-08-2019, 01:51 PM

I'm slowly making up my mind about upgrading the front suspension on my bike.

I think -and I maybe wrong!- that it might be good idea to find some "better forks" and then have those undergo the upgrading work. The reason being that my Showa forks don't have a compression adjustment.

Now I'm not whizz kid on a bike -far from it- but if I am out laying £500 ish on a conversion, I might be better having it done on forks which are fully adjustable.

So anyone know:
What forks are an easy (or easier) swop onto my bike that have potential for full adgustment?

Anybody have some of those ^^^ forks forsale?

Lastly I would welcome your opinions, do I need the full adjustability, or should I simply have the current forks upgraded/conversion and save money and more than likely be totally content in any case?

Rear suspension is being upgraded to a Nitron (thanks to your advice Flip & finding one for a good price thanks to Zimbo).

Looking forward to receiveing the benifit your combined knowledge!

slob · 14-08-2019, 02:09 PM

If you buy upgrade cartridges (eg Nitron TVT) to fit in your forks, they come with adjusters in the top, with compression on one leg and rebound on the other.

Fill in the request form and see what they say about availability for your forks https://www.nitron.co.uk/products/mo.../cartridge-kit

chris.p · 14-08-2019, 03:04 PM

Not sure these are the correct ones, but worth checking with the company, or checkng with FTR Suspension.

https://www.andreanigroup.com/produc...rk+Showa+41%29

jonzi · 14-08-2019, 03:32 PM

The forks on my 796 and not fully adjustable, but I spoke to Maxton and they said they are able to do some machining on them to make them fit their better cartridges.

I haven't had them done yet, but they might be also worth speaking to.

Jez900ie · 14-08-2019, 05:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by slob

If you buy upgrade cartridges (eg Nitron TVT) to fit in your forks, they come with adjusters in the top, with compression on one leg and rebound on the other.

Fill in the request form and see what they say about availability for your forks https://www.nitron.co.uk/products/mo.../cartridge-kit

I will check them out! Thanks

Jez900ie · 14-08-2019, 06:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jonzi

The forks on my 796 and not fully adjustable, but I spoke to Maxton and they said they are able to do some machining on them to make them fit their better cartridges.

I haven't had them done yet, but they might be also worth speaking to.

I am speaking with Maxton, since they are highly reccomended and local!
Maxton Option A is "conversion" which is valving/ springs etc at a cost of £500 ish. They can set it up when installing and proably won't need further adjustment, but...

I'm concerned that I may have regrets on upgrading internals on forks which are not
fully adjustable later on.

Maxton Option B to go the whole hog with with cartridges and all the whistles & bells is £900ish

I am thinking that perhaps there are some better forks available used that will:
Fit my bike without too much hassel
Are fully adjustable
After a Option A £500 conversion will be almost as good as the Option B £900, but will cost overall less and have all the adjustability.

Jez900ie · 14-08-2019, 06:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chris.p

Not sure these are the correct ones, but worth checking with the company, or checkng with FTR Suspension.

https://www.andreanigroup.com/produc...rk+Showa+41%29

Andreani - good Italian name & I will definitely call them. Thanks!

slob · 14-08-2019, 06:32 PM

judging by the 'C' & 'R' on the tops, also compression on one leg and rebound on the other

Jez900ie · 14-08-2019, 06:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by slob

judging by the 'C' & 'R' on the tops, also compression on one leg and rebound on the other

Mine look like this:

slob · 14-08-2019, 07:25 PM

Those are Showas with rebound screws in the middle of the preload adjusters, they should have compression adjusters in the bottom of the legs, reachable through holes in the front wheel spindle (when correctly aligned)

Jez900ie · 14-08-2019, 08:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by slob

Those are Showas with rebound screws in the middle of the preload adjusters, they should have compression adjusters in the bottom of the legs, reachable through holes in the front wheel spindle (when correctly aligned)

free image upload and share

Well the spindles are either not correctly aligned, or not there. I guess I'm going to have to investigate.

Thanks Slob I had no clue about that. I knew I would learn loads from a posting the questions here!

slob · 14-08-2019, 09:07 PM

the spindle *should* look like this

which allows you to line up the slots

and access the compression adjuster screws through the holes

If your bike came with non-adjustable forks and has had them upgraded, but not the spindle, you might need to modify or replace your spindle.
Easy enough to check your forks next time you have the front wheel out though.

While the Showas are adjustable, they're not a great design. The stock needles have too short a taper meaning the valves are fully open from a few clicks out and further adjustment makes little or no difference.

Jez900ie · 14-08-2019, 09:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by slob

the spindle *should* look like this

which allows you to line up the slots

and access the compression adjuster screws through the holes

Brilliant! I might have the right ones... a rotation of the spindle is in order.

Should be straight forward to rotate it... I can probably stick my finger in to find out if the spindle has the access hole easily enough tomorrow.

slob · 14-08-2019, 09:33 PM

Cool! We cross-posted there, while I was adding a little more info. I’ll see if I can find a link to some info on the shortcomings of stock Monster forks.

Flip · 14-08-2019, 10:32 PM

I think a few other questions need to be asked before you decide what route you take to proceed.

Firstly I guess, is why do you want the extra adjustability?

If it's for 'pub bragging rights', have a load of cash burning a hole in your pockets or if you're looking for better set ups as you go from track-day to track-day around the U.K. and beyond then perhaps you might. Softening it up when it's wet and stiffening things when you can really barrel along in the 'fast group' after taking your tyre warmers off and getting out on track.

But if you spend most of the time riding the lovely pot-holed, inconsistently surfaced A and B roads around the Country- then perhaps not (in my opinion, obviously). Where conditions can change around a corner and that sunshine when you left the house turns liquid and you have to ride home in a torrential downpour a couple of hours later.

Riding such roads, i.e. 'normal' riding will always be a compromise to a degree as you ask your suspension to deal with those irregularities and varying road conditions but can be sooo much better than the standard set up the factory gave you.

I get that if you regularly carry a pillion then it might make it a bit nicer to increase the pre-load if you're going for a long enough trip to make it worthwhile doing so (and remembering to set it back afterwards) but again it will always be somewhat of a compromise due to spring weight and the difference carried between solo and two up. Personally, whenever I take a pillion I'm always riding with that little extra in reserve anyway so I never really notice my suspension not being completely optimal.

Next question would be, how much of getting your forks set up do you want to do yourself?

I mean, a lot of us like some spanner time bonding with our bikes in the peace and quiet of the garage and to get that warm feeling when it's all back together so....

If you want the extra satisfaction of stripping, cleaning, replacing all the bushes etc. before fitting completely new cartridges then reassembling it all before going out to fine tune it all then great- go a route like Nirton and one of their excellent looking cartridge kits. I cannot praise their products or customer service highly enough and I am sure with the support they will offer it wouldn't be long before you had it sorted after using their base settings.

But if you can't wait to get out and feel the difference after getting the bike back together with settings that will work perfectly (in my experiences) knowing you have used one of the best companies in Europe for suspension then go to Maxton.

I have said it many times here (sorry to bore some of you) but it's what they do- you only have to look at the number of riders (and types of motorcycles from current nutter sports bikes to classic machinery) that choose Maxton for their TT and Classic TT entries (not to mention short circuit racing) to know that their suspension works on the road and it works no matter how fast or whatever type of riding you do.

It was through racing my 1965 250 Ducati that I discovered just how much they can improve things- I thought anything would be better than the gear oil filled forks I had but I was totally blown away, even with the basic set-up (which I chose as I replaced the rear shocks as well and had a budget) just how much better it was.

Part 2 to follow....

14-08-2019, 01:51 PM	#1
Jez900ie Pleasantly surprised! Join Date: Nov 2016 Location: Stoke on Trent Bike: M900ie Posts: 780	Forks & Upgrades? I'm slowly making up my mind about upgrading the front suspension on my bike. I think -and I maybe wrong!- that it might be good idea to find some "better forks" and then have those undergo the upgrading work. The reason being that my Showa forks don't have a compression adjustment. Now I'm not whizz kid on a bike -far from it- but if I am out laying £500 ish on a conversion, I might be better having it done on forks which are fully adjustable. So anyone know: What forks are an easy (or easier) swop onto my bike that have potential for full adgustment? Anybody have some of those ^^^ forks forsale? Lastly I would welcome your opinions, do I need the full adjustability, or should I simply have the current forks upgraded/conversion and save money and more than likely be totally content in any case? Rear suspension is being upgraded to a Nitron (thanks to your advice Flip & finding one for a good price thanks to Zimbo). Looking forward to receiveing the benifit your combined knowledge! __________________ Monsters don't hide under the bed, they sleep inside the shed Last edited by Jez900ie; 14-08-2019 at 01:55 PM..

14-08-2019, 03:32 PM	#4
jonzi Mary Mary Quite Contrary Join Date: Mar 2012 Location: Berkhamsted Bike: M796 Posts: 1,398	The forks on my 796 and not fully adjustable, but I spoke to Maxton and they said they are able to do some machining on them to make them fit their better cartridges. I haven't had them done yet, but they might be also worth speaking to. __________________ #48

14-08-2019, 09:07 PM	#12
slob . Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: East London Bike: Multiple Monsters Posts: 9,736	the spindle should look like this which allows you to line up the slots and access the compression adjuster screws through the holes If your bike came with non-adjustable forks and has had them upgraded, but not the spindle, you might need to modify or replace your spindle. Easy enough to check your forks next time you have the front wheel out though. While the Showas are adjustable, they're not a great design. The stock needles have too short a taper meaning the valves are fully open from a few clicks out and further adjustment makes little or no difference. Last edited by slob; 14-08-2019 at 09:14 PM..

14-08-2019, 10:32 PM	#15
Flip Registered User Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Beachtown Bike: M900 Posts: 2,188	I think a few other questions need to be asked before you decide what route you take to proceed. Firstly I guess, is why do you want the extra adjustability? If it's for 'pub bragging rights', have a load of cash burning a hole in your pockets or if you're looking for better set ups as you go from track-day to track-day around the U.K. and beyond then perhaps you might. Softening it up when it's wet and stiffening things when you can really barrel along in the 'fast group' after taking your tyre warmers off and getting out on track. But if you spend most of the time riding the lovely pot-holed, inconsistently surfaced A and B roads around the Country- then perhaps not (in my opinion, obviously). Where conditions can change around a corner and that sunshine when you left the house turns liquid and you have to ride home in a torrential downpour a couple of hours later. Riding such roads, i.e. 'normal' riding will always be a compromise to a degree as you ask your suspension to deal with those irregularities and varying road conditions but can be sooo much better than the standard set up the factory gave you. I get that if you regularly carry a pillion then it might make it a bit nicer to increase the pre-load if you're going for a long enough trip to make it worthwhile doing so (and remembering to set it back afterwards) but again it will always be somewhat of a compromise due to spring weight and the difference carried between solo and two up. Personally, whenever I take a pillion I'm always riding with that little extra in reserve anyway so I never really notice my suspension not being completely optimal. Next question would be, how much of getting your forks set up do you want to do yourself? I mean, a lot of us like some spanner time bonding with our bikes in the peace and quiet of the garage and to get that warm feeling when it's all back together so.... If you want the extra satisfaction of stripping, cleaning, replacing all the bushes etc. before fitting completely new cartridges then reassembling it all before going out to fine tune it all then great- go a route like Nirton and one of their excellent looking cartridge kits. I cannot praise their products or customer service highly enough and I am sure with the support they will offer it wouldn't be long before you had it sorted after using their base settings. But if you can't wait to get out and feel the difference after getting the bike back together with settings that will work perfectly (in my experiences) knowing you have used one of the best companies in Europe for suspension then go to Maxton. I have said it many times here (sorry to bore some of you) but it's what they do- you only have to look at the number of riders (and types of motorcycles from current nutter sports bikes to classic machinery) that choose Maxton for their TT and Classic TT entries (not to mention short circuit racing) to know that their suspension works on the road and it works no matter how fast or whatever type of riding you do. It was through racing my 1965 250 Ducati that I discovered just how much they can improve things- I thought anything would be better than the gear oil filled forks I had but I was totally blown away, even with the basic set-up (which I chose as I replaced the rear shocks as well and had a budget) just how much better it was. Part 2 to follow.... __________________ You're perfect, yes, it's true- But without me you're only you!

14-08-2019, 02:09 PM	#2
slob . Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: East London Bike: Multiple Monsters Posts: 9,736	If you buy upgrade cartridges (eg Nitron TVT) to fit in your forks, they come with adjusters in the top, with compression on one leg and rebound on the other. Fill in the request form and see what they say about availability for your forks https://www.nitron.co.uk/products/mo.../cartridge-kit

14-08-2019, 03:04 PM	#3
chris.p Gold Member Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: lincoln Bike: No Bike Yet! Posts: 876	Not sure these are the correct ones, but worth checking with the company, or checkng with FTR Suspension. https://www.andreanigroup.com/produc...rk+Showa+41%29

14-08-2019, 06:32 PM	#8
slob . Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: East London Bike: Multiple Monsters Posts: 9,736	judging by the 'C' & 'R' on the tops, also compression on one leg and rebound on the other

14-08-2019, 07:25 PM	#10
slob . Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: East London Bike: Multiple Monsters Posts: 9,736	Those are Showas with rebound screws in the middle of the preload adjusters, they should have compression adjusters in the bottom of the legs, reachable through holes in the front wheel spindle (when correctly aligned)

14-08-2019, 09:33 PM	#14
slob . Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: East London Bike: Multiple Monsters Posts: 9,736	Cool! We cross-posted there, while I was adding a little more info. I’ll see if I can find a link to some info on the shortcomings of stock Monster forks.