Self service and warranty

22-01-2007, 09:06 PM

I have just bought an s2r1000. It has 2yrs warranty, but they insist I have to get the service done by a ducati approved mechanic. Now I am mechanic, a bike mechanic level 2 qualified, half way through level 3 and one of the first licensed motorcycle mechanics in the UK. Did a trail run about 3 weeks ago for ATA/IMI similiar to what coggie do. We were invited to be the first people as they couldn't think of better run workshop than ours.

Anyway surely I can use my work stamp? Fair enough they don't do ducati's but my workshop is better equiped and ran than some of the ducati workshops i've been to by 5 times.

Whats the law on this like? Can they refuse warranty if I do it at my work?

CK & AK · 22-01-2007, 09:31 PM

Rules are: it must be serviced by an authorised Ducati mechanic.

However, I am sure Duncan will be along (or others) to say that you are legally within your right to get the service carried out where you like, by any bike dealer. Check with citizens advice on this, as they are quite helpful.

Ducati are quite strict about warranties, they have to cover themselves for any parts not being replaced correctly. They also state that almost ALL non-authorised mechanics will not have the appropriate training on the bikes - nor will they have the full workshop manuals.

FWIW, we have had ours done by dealer when in warranty (but have done plugs/oils/filter etc ourselves, as we have v good rapport with dealer), but AK does everything afterwards when out of warranty, at home.

The belts are not so easy on the 1000ds engines as the other bikes to do - in fact mine were a right bu88er the first time.

C

22-01-2007, 09:39 PM

See i've always thought aslong as you use use genuine parts and can show that the work was done by someone competent and to the schedule they cannot use it to get out of honouring the warranty.

Ooo what makes the belts harder to change on the DS engine then?

CK & AK · 22-01-2007, 09:43 PM

Take your casing off & have a look

22-01-2007, 09:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by klause

See i've always thought aslong as you use use genuine parts and can show that the work was done by someone competent and to the schedule they cannot use it to get out of honouring the warranty.

That is what I believe the case to be. However, is it worth the hassle with Ducati if anything does go wrong under warranty? Unless you do high mileages you are only looking at two services - the 600 mile one, and then the 1st year which is a cheapy anyway. When it gets to the second year, don't bother with Ducati (unless you want to keep all the stamps pukka for resale value) as it's going to be out of warranty anyway. I plan on getting my second year one done with a local specialist, not the dealer. I think that so many owners do this now that it doesn't really devalue the bike by not having the Ducati dealer stamps in the book, as long as it is a recognised specialist.

22-01-2007, 09:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CK & AK

Take your casing off & have a look

Haha, Yeah well I only got the bike Saturday so no stripping yet i've promised myself. They were a piece of **** on the 750 and 600 but I guess the 1000ds is differen't, does the 2nd sparkplug get in the way or something? Or just much tighter fit in general?

Basically i've come up with the plan to log all my work, take photos of the clock to record mileage, picies of all the parts laid out and keep receipts to cover my arse. Will also get my workshop manager to witness it and sign it.

Im not wasting 2-3years of my life learning about motorcycles to let someone else do it!

So how much are the first two services?

22-01-2007, 10:01 PM

The only thing I would say is if a premature failure happens just outside warranty.
Here is a true story of a problem we had with Kawasaki. My wifes zx6r(G2) dropped a valve when she was riding it and stopped the engine virtually dead, luckily she managed to control it and was ok. The bike was 6 months outside of warranty, 12000 miles on clock and fully serviced by Kawasaki dealerships. When I spoke with Kawasaki my argument that this was not a reasonable failure and we had done all required if not more to ensure the bike was serviced correctly, Kawasaki as a good will gesture paid for local dealer to repair the engine, 15 hours labour, new sleave and valves etc.. Thankfully without any fuss (phew).

Personally when in warranty and even if close to when warranty is about to expire I would suggest a Ducati authorised workshop. Once its fully out of warranty them its really down to personal choice, if you have a decent ducati dealership and happy with them then let them continue. If you have a very good non franchise ducati workshop nearby then its up to you.

As for doing your own servicing and stamping the book whilst in warranty I am sure you would find that ducati would be very sceptical about honouring its warranty.

But its your bike, and I am sure it may bring up questions when you try to sell.

CK & AK · 22-01-2007, 10:07 PM

Klause - you need to remove the bottom pulley to get the belt off, with a special (Ducati) tool - which you can make if you want to - but its a right pain in the ass - so I brought one!

For servicing you will need a good selection of shims, which on the 1000 engine, as they are the same as the 4 valve engine, not demeaning what you have done, but have you adjusted desmotronic valve gear before?
Please dont take offence at this - I was a fully qual Kwak mechanic ( as well as muscle & high performance jap cars as a sideline!), but had never touched the Ducati's until 5 years ago

They are quite easy in their own way specially on the 2 valvers to do, but it is practice and having the specific tools for some of the jobs

I'm not sure if you can get an aftermarket shim kit yet for the 4 valvers and 1000ds, but I think the ducati kit is £350/£400

Good luck

Alan

Pedro · 22-01-2007, 10:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CK & AK

...... but have you adjusted desmotronic valve gear before?....

Hey Al, last time I looked it was Desmodromic valve gear - have you got something new??

CK & AK · 22-01-2007, 10:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pedro

Hey Al, last time I looked it was Desmodromic valve gear - have you got something new??

ok, at least someone is reading what I typed

22-01-2007, 10:43 PM

Part of the block exception laws in the vehicle industry, mean that as long as you use parts of the same quality as OE then any warranty claim, as long as it has been serviced to Ducati standards you should be ok.
They have to prove a non Ducati part has caused the problem.

If not the warranty stands withe manufacture of the OE part,which will usually Honor the repair(in most cases it is due to incorrect fitments!

22-01-2007, 10:51 PM

Well I got my monster at 14k and now its on 47k so yes I've done a few valve adjustments in my time of owning it and not once taken it to be serviced. Also stripped a 900 engine just because i wanted to learn more and it was so easy, I made that tool to get the pulleys off out of an impact socket but I shall probably buy the real deal.

Yes i know what you mean there are many types of mechanics out there some don't deserve the name but I aim to be the very best I can and always forwarding my career with training.

23-01-2007, 09:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CK & AK

Klause - you need to remove the bottom pulley to get the belt off, with a special (Ducati) tool - which you can make if you want to - but its a right pain in the ass - so I brought one!

That's interesting as I didn't have to remove the bottom pully when I changed the belts on mt 1000ds. Was tight but the belts just managed to slip between the pully and the engine casing.

Chris

jerry · 24-01-2007, 04:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CK & AK

Klause - you need to remove the bottom pulley to get the belt off, with a special (Ducati) tool - which you can make if you want to - but its a right pain in the ass - so I brought one!

For servicing you will need a good selection of shims, which on the 1000 engine, as they are the same as the 4 valve engine, not demeaning what you have done, but have you adjusted desmotronic valve gear before?
Please dont take offence at this - I was a fully qual Kwak mechanic ( as well as muscle & high performance jap cars as a sideline!), but had never touched the Ducati's until 5 years ago

They are quite easy in their own way specially on the 2 valvers to do, but it is practice and having the specific tools for some of the jobs

I'm not sure if you can get an aftermarket shim kit yet for the 4 valvers and 1000ds, but I think the ducati kit is £350/£400

Good luck

Alan

4 valve shim kit from www.emsduc.com $339,+postage to UK

nice guy to deal with

jerry

25-01-2007, 01:09 PM

I know where to take my bike now, if I get bored of spannering it, Klause

My Bandit has always been serviced by myself since the first (600 miles) service in 1999. This was the same thought that crossed through my mind when I started doing the servicing myself, but 7 years on and 76,000 miles on the thing, it's not had a problem. So I see myself as a lucky git!!

22-01-2007, 09:06 PM	#1
klause Guest Posts: n/a	Self service and warranty I have just bought an s2r1000. It has 2yrs warranty, but they insist I have to get the service done by a ducati approved mechanic. Now I am mechanic, a bike mechanic level 2 qualified, half way through level 3 and one of the first licensed motorcycle mechanics in the UK. Did a trail run about 3 weeks ago for ATA/IMI similiar to what coggie do. We were invited to be the first people as they couldn't think of better run workshop than ours. Anyway surely I can use my work stamp? Fair enough they don't do ducati's but my workshop is better equiped and ran than some of the ducati workshops i've been to by 5 times. Whats the law on this like? Can they refuse warranty if I do it at my work?

22-01-2007, 10:01 PM	#7
sadbiker Guest Posts: n/a	The only thing I would say is if a premature failure happens just outside warranty. Here is a true story of a problem we had with Kawasaki. My wifes zx6r(G2) dropped a valve when she was riding it and stopped the engine virtually dead, luckily she managed to control it and was ok. The bike was 6 months outside of warranty, 12000 miles on clock and fully serviced by Kawasaki dealerships. When I spoke with Kawasaki my argument that this was not a reasonable failure and we had done all required if not more to ensure the bike was serviced correctly, Kawasaki as a good will gesture paid for local dealer to repair the engine, 15 hours labour, new sleave and valves etc.. Thankfully without any fuss (phew). Personally when in warranty and even if close to when warranty is about to expire I would suggest a Ducati authorised workshop. Once its fully out of warranty them its really down to personal choice, if you have a decent ducati dealership and happy with them then let them continue. If you have a very good non franchise ducati workshop nearby then its up to you. As for doing your own servicing and stamping the book whilst in warranty I am sure you would find that ducati would be very sceptical about honouring its warranty. But its your bike, and I am sure it may bring up questions when you try to sell. Last edited by sadbiker; 22-01-2007 at 10:03 PM..

22-01-2007, 09:31 PM	#2
CK & AK flob-a-lob-a-lob Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: NW Surrey Bike: Multiple Monsters Posts: 3,306	Rules are: it must be serviced by an authorised Ducati mechanic. However, I am sure Duncan will be along (or others) to say that you are legally within your right to get the service carried out where you like, by any bike dealer. Check with citizens advice on this, as they are quite helpful. Ducati are quite strict about warranties, they have to cover themselves for any parts not being replaced correctly. They also state that almost ALL non-authorised mechanics will not have the appropriate training on the bikes - nor will they have the full workshop manuals. FWIW, we have had ours done by dealer when in warranty (but have done plugs/oils/filter etc ourselves, as we have v good rapport with dealer), but AK does everything afterwards when out of warranty, at home. The belts are not so easy on the 1000ds engines as the other bikes to do - in fact mine were a right bu88er the first time. C

22-01-2007, 09:39 PM	#3
klause Guest Posts: n/a	See i've always thought aslong as you use use genuine parts and can show that the work was done by someone competent and to the schedule they cannot use it to get out of honouring the warranty. Ooo what makes the belts harder to change on the DS engine then?

22-01-2007, 09:43 PM	#4
CK & AK flob-a-lob-a-lob Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: NW Surrey Bike: Multiple Monsters Posts: 3,306	Take your casing off & have a look

22-01-2007, 10:07 PM	#8
CK & AK flob-a-lob-a-lob Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: NW Surrey Bike: Multiple Monsters Posts: 3,306	Klause - you need to remove the bottom pulley to get the belt off, with a special (Ducati) tool - which you can make if you want to - but its a right pain in the ass - so I brought one! For servicing you will need a good selection of shims, which on the 1000 engine, as they are the same as the 4 valve engine, not demeaning what you have done, but have you adjusted desmotronic valve gear before? Please dont take offence at this - I was a fully qual Kwak mechanic ( as well as muscle & high performance jap cars as a sideline!), but had never touched the Ducati's until 5 years ago They are quite easy in their own way specially on the 2 valvers to do, but it is practice and having the specific tools for some of the jobs I'm not sure if you can get an aftermarket shim kit yet for the 4 valvers and 1000ds, but I think the ducati kit is £350/£400 Good luck Alan

22-01-2007, 10:43 PM	#11
bod Guest Posts: n/a	Part of the block exception laws in the vehicle industry, mean that as long as you use parts of the same quality as OE then any warranty claim, as long as it has been serviced to Ducati standards you should be ok. They have to prove a non Ducati part has caused the problem. If not the warranty stands withe manufacture of the OE part,which will usually Honor the repair(in most cases it is due to incorrect fitments!

22-01-2007, 10:51 PM	#12
klause Guest Posts: n/a	Well I got my monster at 14k and now its on 47k so yes I've done a few valve adjustments in my time of owning it and not once taken it to be serviced. Also stripped a 900 engine just because i wanted to learn more and it was so easy, I made that tool to get the pulleys off out of an impact socket but I shall probably buy the real deal. Yes i know what you mean there are many types of mechanics out there some don't deserve the name but I aim to be the very best I can and always forwarding my career with training.

25-01-2007, 01:09 PM	#15
banditloon Guest Posts: n/a	I know where to take my bike now, if I get bored of spannering it, Klause My Bandit has always been serviced by myself since the first (600 miles) service in 1999. This was the same thought that crossed through my mind when I started doing the servicing myself, but 7 years on and 76,000 miles on the thing, it's not had a problem. So I see myself as a lucky git!!